Stories from the Korean War

– Me llamo José Vidal Beltrán Molano. Mi grado en el Ejército: cabo primero. Formo parte de la Junta Directiva de ASCOE por el cargo de vocal. Quiero hacer un recuento de mi vida antes de ir a Corea. Trabajaba aquí, en este palacio, palacio presidencial, trabajé cinco años. Aquí estaba trabajando antes de ir a Corea voluntariamente a luchar por la democracia y la libertad de Corea del Sur. Me siento orgulloso de haber pertenecido a ese ejército libertador en su país, a ese grupo que fuimos a luchar por la libertad, por la democracia de Corea, de un pueblo oprimido en aquella ocasión. Yo permanecí 15 meses en Corea. Mi comandante fue, con mi, en esa época, coronel Ruiz Novoa, quien falleció en días pasados, hoy general de la República. Mi experiencia allí en Corea fue bastante difícil porque, por el idioma, por las costumbres. Para mí era un país desconocido, gente desconocida, pero gente amable, gente muy querida por la cual luchamos hasta donde fue posible. De mi regreso a Colombia tengo la experiencia de haber sido recibido aquí, en mi país, con honores. Después, formé una familia. Tengo ocho hijos, todos profesionales, un militar, el menor de mi familia, de mis hijos, coronel de la Fuerza Aérea Colombiana. Hemos recibido en la Embajada de Corea, he recibido muchas atenciones, muchos agasajos, beneficios para mis, para mis nietos en cuanto a educación. Y he encontrado mucho apoyo en todos los casos en los cuales hemos tenido que ver mucho con la colonia de Corea. Cualquier pregunta que quiera hacerme, con mucho gusto.
– ¿Qué piensa de que, de Corea y coreanos y el futuro de Corea? Porque la guerra no termina.
– No la, no la escucho, no la entiendo.
– ¿Visitas, visita a Corea?
– Ah, sí, hace dos años estuve por una invitación del presidente de Corea, estuve visitando Corea después de 60 años de haber estado allá en la guerra. Fui muy bien atendido, muy bien recibido. Nos recibieron, fui en compañía de cuatro compañeros más. Fuimos recibidos como héroes. Nos atendieron muy bien. Corea, especialmente Seúl, ha cambiado muchísimo de la época en que estuvimos en la guerra a como se encuentra ahora. Corea se ha desarrollado muchísimo, ha progresado, y me alegra muchísimo que Corea en este momento sea uno de las potencias económicas del mundo, y que su gente maravillosa todavía nos recuerda después de más de 60 años, nos recuerda con cariño y con gratitud. Y todavía en esta fecha nos están dando las gracias por el sacrificio que hicimos por el pueblo de Corea del Sur.

-Estas placas fueron instaladas el, el 14 de Noviembre del 2000, del año 2007, ante una ceremonia muy hermosa con todos los destacamentos militares, la asistencia del comandante del Ejército, el Estado Mayor, la Armada Nacional, y mucho público y todos los veteranos de la guerra de Corea. Fue algo, fue muy conmovedor para la ciudadanía de Bogotá y para todos los militares y veteranos que asistimos, puesto que no se había colocado en ninguna parte de Colombia por parte del Gobierno ninguna conmemoración, ningún recuerdo a los muertos de la guerra. Estábamos buscando y yo me dediqué a buscar con ellos. Y un buen día, tuve la inspiración de venir aquí y proponerle al padre párroco que, que si me daba permiso de colocar las placas acá en este lugar tan sagrado para la, donde están los mártires de la patria. E inmediatamente me aceptó. El general Álvaro Valencia Tovar, que en paz descanse, puso todo el empeño por su experiencia militar. Fue comandante del Ejército, estuvo en la guerra de Corea, fue el comandante de la primera acción contra los chinos. Y me dijo: “Isaac, cuente con mi apoyo porque esa idea no se me había presentado a mí, no se me había ocurrido a mí. Yo lo apoyo”. Y cuando me di cuenta, pues, comunicó al Estado Mayor, convocó a todas las fuerzas militares, y fue algo esplendoroso. Que, por eso esas placas están aquí. Yo puse mi aporte espiritual y no más. Que Dios tenga sus almas en su, su, su reino. Gracias.

>> Excuse me. My name is Bill Pavel. I was in the Korean War 1953 to ’54. I joined the 3rd Battalion, Royal Canadian Regiment, airborne regiment, although they weren’t used over there, and I was approximately 19 years old when I went over. I joined up in Toronto, took my basic training in Petawawa. That’s Northern Ontario, and once you become a Private First Class, then you qualify to go overseas into a combat zone, but you must have so many months of training, you know, in hand grenades, rifles, grain guns, et cetera, before they send you. You don’t just join up and 3 days later, they ship you out. It doesn’t work that way. You have to go through this basic training, they call it. It’s the same as most armies. There’s a basic-training period where you experience … You get behind tanks. Tanks are firing all the time, and I was in the infantry, and you follow them, and you root up gullies and dig a slit trench, and you get trained. You never get really enough training because once you get to the front line and the actual circumstances, everything changes, but it does help. Where I had one advantage, not only me but most guys from down from the maritimes, you were never far from the woods. When I was 15 years old, I bought my first .22, and I lived in the woods, shooting rabbits, stuff like that, and I was also in the Sea Cadets and the Air Cadets, and I learned map reading and how to use a compass even at that young age, so I guess what I’m trying to say is, when I went to the Army, I had a lot of advantages that other people didn’t have. And I’ll give you one example. When I joined up, we went to Petawawa, and I laugh when I say this, but we all got together, a platoon of 32 people, soldiers, and the sergeant said, “Okay, everybody build a fire.” Simple little thing, build a fire, so I go in the woods, grab all the dead twigs, break them all up, start my fire, no problem. Probably 10 minutes, smoke coming up, and these city slickers, I used to call them, they had green branches with green leaves on it, and they’re trying to light it, you know? So what I’m trying to say is, coming from Nova Scotia, like an area like that where you’re more or less brought up in the woods because my uncles and cousins, they went into the bush, and I’d see them coming home, and you’d have thought they were John Wayne. They all had a shotgun and a bullet belt on. You kind of looked up to them. As soon as you got to that age, you did the same thing and followed suit, so that was a big advantage for me when I was in the Army, very big advantage. And why I got in, like I say, I was hitchhiking across the country 2 years in a row, ’50, ’51. The war had broken out in 1950. I think it was June, and I thought about it, you know, but after hitchhiking 2 years, I worked on ranch in Alberta, for example. I wasn’t going anywhere, seeing the country, of course, getting a little bit of an education, but one day, we just got fed up, and we said, “Look, let’s go to Korea.” Never heard of Korea before, but we knew it was somewhere in the area of Japan and China, et cetera. So the call went out, and they got 26,000 volunteers, all volunteers, and, like I say, I went the last year of the war, very last year, 1953. And I joined with two or three guys, and one thing about the Army, it’s a very lonely place. You know, you always like to have a buddy, and I was lucky. One guy made the grade, and he came across with me, and because when you’re in the Army, even when you’re in a platoon with 32 guys, you only make maybe three or four real close friends. You do a lot of drinking, et cetera and stuff like that when you’re on the Army base, but as far as the whole battalion, which is about 1,200 people, you might know a few officers. That’s all, and so what I’m trying to say is, when you went to Korea, it was good to go with somebody that you knew quite well, had something in common, so that was kind of a break for me, and I joined up, and I’ll never forget, long as I live, but you see families that hug and kiss all the time that are real close. Well, we weren’t like that. We were kind of standoffish, and one thing that sticks in my mind is, when I got older and had children that got my age, they could’ve been going overseas, but when I went overseas, my mother was standing there. The door was here, and I was waving. I just said, “Good-bye, Mom,” and that always bothered me when I got older. At that time, it didn’t. It was just normal. We didn’t run over and hug, kiss and cry and all that stuff, but I often wonder how she felt when I’m walking out that door. That was hard to take later on, not then but later on. And I said, “Good-bye,” and we left. We didn’t have cell phones then. Might write her two letters a year from Korea, and now, the sounds, by the way, people contact each other. It’s kind of sickening to me because they walk out the door, and they’re on a cell phone, talking to their boyfriend or girlfriend or something. I don’t know who the heck it is, or they’re texting. So they often wonder what we were like. I probably wouldn’t have texted anything. There wasn’t a phone guy at the time either. So my mother had five children. My father died in 1935, so she had five kids, you imagine. It was in the Depression, and we were very, very poor. I didn’t think anybody was any poorer until I went to Korea, and then I see real poverty. It was just unbelievable. It’s unbelievable, and it was a real eye-opener for me that there was another world out there, and we were spoiled rotten, just like today even. The Western World is spoiled rotten. There’s people that … You can’t explain it. And so I left, and I went to …

>> What do you mean, they were so poor? Can you explain what you remember, how poor?

>> Well, we didn’t know. We never seen money. I never seen a …

>> You said in Korea.

>> I remember once, I got a nickel for a …

>> No, in Korea, you said that …

>> Oh, Korea was the most outstanding.

>> Can you describe?

>> Actually, it was in Japan where I’d seen it first. We were stationed in Japan, and we got there, and there was … The officers tried to tell us not to fraternize with the girls. There was too much VD, et cetera, and there was lots of it. But one day, I’m at the gates. The gate was locked. There’s a guard there. This mother was coming with her little child, oh, maybe 13, and enticing us to take the child into our home and have sex. You’d have to pay some money, but it wasn’t that much, and I’d seen that. It kind of gave me a jolt, and that wasn’t uncommon. That was a very common thing in Japan and in Korea, I didn’t experience that because I wasn’t around the population too much except once when I was in Pusan. I seen literally, say, this street here, goes straight down to the beach there, and there was just thousands and thousands of people just walking up and down. That’s all it was, and I had a camera with me.

>> You had a camera in 1953?

>> In ’53 because Japan was starting to make cameras and watches cheap. Japan had a very bad name then. They’ve changed, of course, they’ve progressed, but at that time, you could buy a camera, oh, maybe for $2 to $5, so I bought one. I think it cost me $10, and just me and my buddy were going up this street in … It was Incheon, not Pusan. It was Incheon, and he rolled out a stack out of tens, and he went like this. “I’ll give you $30, $40 for that camera,” and he went flip, flip, flip, and it looked like $40 to me, but I was still suspicious because he’d done it so fast. I took the camera off, and I gave it to him, and he gave me the money, and I didn’t want to let the camera go. I didn’t even look at it yet, so he got the camera, and he took off, and sure enough, there was one $10 bill there. The rest was paper. I don’t know how he’d done it yet. It was just amazing, but we got angry, so the next day, and this is hard to believe too. Next day, we’re on the same street, and I look up, oh, maybe 10 rows of people, and I see him again. He’s coming towards us, the guy is, so I said, “Here he comes. You stand there, and I’ll stand here, and we’ll grab him.” So we tried to grab him, and we couldn’t. He ran up the street and went into an alley, so we ran up the street into an alley, and in that alley was … It was like this, like a semicircle, and every house was a prostitute house. There were girls there, all young girls and everything.

>> In Korea?

>> Yeah, this is in Korea, yeah. They were all brothels, the whole bunch of them. But that didn’t bother us, and all of a sudden, out of the alley comes this guy with two other guys, and they both had a knife about that long, and they were coming. They’re not charging us, but they’re walking towards us, and so we backed out of there very diplomatically. We didn’t tackle them or nothing. We just took off, and that was my first introduction with people that were … That really couldn’t go any lower. And the word was that a family in Korea at the time, a fairly prosperous family, made about $300 a year, and we used to get our shoes shined by them. Little kids would be there shining shoes, and we’d give them $0.50 sometimes, and we’d use it quite frequently, and they’d do our laundry and everything. But at the time, I didn’t realize they were making good money. We thought it was just peanuts, but to them, I guess it must have been manna from heaven, which is unbelievable. So anyway, that was that part of it, and …

>> You went in 1953, right before the armistice was signed in 1953, July 27th.

>> Yes.

>> So how long did you stay in Korea?

>> How long?

>> How long did you stay in Korea?

>> Oh, I stayed in Korea. There was a great, big battle on Hill 187. The 3rd Battalion RCR fought that battle, and I was supposed to go on that draft, but I didn’t. I didn’t make it because I didn’t have enough training, so there, they had their battle. I think there was more people killed and captured in that battle than all the other battles in Korea, 187. However, they had to get reinforcements because they needed more troops, so what, they … When you’re a volunteer to go, they line you up in a place where … And they ask you. They say, “Bill Pavel, do you want to go to Korea, volunteer to go to Korea?” “That’s right. Yes, sir,” just like that. In other words, you just stay in line. Don’t step over, and you didn’t have to go, so everybody that went to Korea had the same question, “Do you want to go to Korea?” And you only had to say yes or no. I guess a lot said no, but the majority of them said yes. They went, and …

>> What did you expect? By 1953, didn’t you know that there were many, many who fought or died?

>> Oh, yes, yes.

>> And you still said yes?

>> So, yeah. The word was filtered back. “Hey, Charlie so-and-so was killed on Hill 187, RCR.”

>> Because I would think I wouldn’t want to go, seeing people that I knew or people from my country dying in a foreign land.

>> Well, you’ve got to understand Canada to know why. Canada was going to war since the World War. They went to World War I, and it was a slaughter. They went to World War II, and it was a slaughter, but all the generations probably looked up to their fathers and their uncles, like I had an uncle killed in World War I on December the 25th, 1914, just Christmastime, and it almost killed their parents. They never did get over it, but you got friends on your street that were in World War II. I remember, I was sorry I missed the World War II. I was just too young. Lot of guys lied to get there. They were 17 years old. They went, same with Korea, and you seen that thing I gave you about the first night? We landed in Korea, and after that battle, they had filled up the battalion. The battalion was way understaffed even to begin with, which is a tragedy, really. I didn’t know it at the time, but I know it now, that there was supposed to be 120, 25, 30 people in a company, and when I was over there, it was only 70, and then I found out later, later on, like I’m talking 40 years later, that even those guys that were in that battle, they only had about 75 or 80 people. In other words, they didn’t have enough people there, and I don’t know whose fault that was, but that’s the way it went. But when I went to Korea, we landed in Japan after 20 or 21 days on the ship, sailed from Seattle and landed in Yokohama, and we went through Kuri, the other side of Japan. Then we got on another ship to take us to Korea, and we landed at Pusan. So when you landed at Pusan, then you … First thing was the smell. As you’ll know, the Koreans used human excretion for fertilizer. We never experienced that before. You could smell that. Wasn’t too bad when you got on the front lines because you’re way up in the mountains, but all the way up in Korea, we’re on this train, very narrow train. It was a narrow, little bit narrower than ours. Every time the train would stop, it was a steam engine. It had to stop for water. There would be kids out there with their arms cut off, legs cut off, begging out the window, and we’d throw chocolate bars, et cetera, and stuff like that, and I started saying to myself, “What the hell is this?” And then again, the same thing happened. At that age, it didn’t really mow you down or nothing. We felt sad, but later on, now, you really feel it because I got PTSD and everything from a few other instances like that, and so we went up there, and we went to the front line. That page I gave you, you read that, and that’ll tell you every soldier that ever came from Canada. When he went to the front line, that’s exactly what happened. We went up there. It was dark, and you’d see the odd flare, and you’d hear machine gun fire off to the right, and the sergeant said, “Don’t worry about it. That’s miles away.” It travels, sound, very far in those valleys. And as the car was opening, guy is over here, and he says, “Find yourself a place to sleep.” I said, “You got to be joking.” I said, “Nobody can sleep here.” The fear, and then you realize that at that moment, you realize you’re in a war. All the other times, you’re laughing and joking and drinking and having a ball. No matter where you were, you were having a ball. But once you’re up there, you had your rifle, and you said, “Okay, you go to sleep now,” and there was no way you could go to sleep, and you read that one page, you’ll get an impact from that, and basically what it says is, you did sleep. But I’m there laying in a hole in the ground, and I hear this whimpering. I hear this guy, “I want my mama. I want my mama.” I said, “What the hell is that?” And it was right over here. It was one of us. So I crawl over, and here’s this guy. I’ll never forget as long as I live. He’s curled up like this in the fetal position, and he’s saying, “I want my mama,” and he’s bawling, and he was 17. He told me, “I’m only 17 years old,” so I got the captain, and I said, “Listen, you better get this guy out of here because he’s not supposed to be here anyway,” so they shipped him out and sent him back because he lied about his age, and they didn’t check that carefully in those days. And that was my first night in Korea. That was it. And I’m still looking for that guy. I think I found him, but I don’t want to tell him. You know what I mean? Because one guy told me, he met a guy that they sent him home. He was crying for his mother or something, and he’s a good friend of mine, but he doesn’t know I know that, and I don’t want to tell him. It’s too embarrassing for him, I guess. Now, I don’t even know it’s him for sure, but everything fits. So when you got to the front line, it was night time. It was black, and it was extremely dangerous because the Chinese, that’s when they used to attack, after dusk. If they didn’t attack, they would come up and say, “You, you and you and you.” You’d get five or six guys to go on a night patrol, which was a big mistake when I think back on it because a lot of guys got killed on that. And you would get up, blacken up your faces and all that stuff, and the sunset, you walked out into no-man’s-land, trying to catch a prisoner, something like that. It’s kind of silly. I think it worked about four or five times in the whole war, and guys were going out, 26-guy patrols. But the valley out there usually was all paddies, rice paddies, and you were sneaking your way through there, and you could hear the Chinese talking. They’d be somewhere in the hills somewhere. They’d be talking, but they’d also have patrols out too. They’d have these patrols out there that would ambush you. They’d be waiting. They knew we were going to go out there that night or something. They had their own intelligence, and there’d be a firefight right out there, and maybe last corporal and maybe six regular soldiers trying to retreat, trying to get back to the lines because there was minefields all over the place. You only had to walk certain ways. If you stepped on a mine, you were going to get killed anyway, and that was it. And so there was quite a few casualties in the valleys because of these patrols, but I guess the powers that be felt they had the intelligence to know if they were still out there because other times, now, in the bigger battles, the ones that I missed, thank God, they’d come in by the thousands, and you got to remember, they’re coming up the hill, and the Canadians are on top of the hill shooting down, and they’re coming up the hill, and they also had tremendous artillery behind us, our artillery, and even the Americans sometimes, and they had a spotter up there. When those Chinese were coming by the thousands, they’d shoot a few flares up in the air, and they’d phone back the coordinates and the artillery, and before you even fired a shot, these shells were coming in and all that. First of all, the shells would come in from the Chinese, and you had to dig down into the ground, and you just hoped your name wasn’t on one of them, and they would blow the whole … There was no trees up there. It was all shrub because no trees could grow, and we called in air artillery, and we could see them down there, thousands of Chinese, some with no weapons. They’d run until somebody would get shot with a weapon. They’d pick up his weapon and keep coming. They’re fanatics, but I found out later that when the Chinese first came into battle, first, it was the North Koreans with the Russian tanks and all that stuff, but when the Chinese came in, in the southern province of China, they just grabbed everybody that was a farmer’s kid, and he was in the army, untrained, “You’re coming.” That’s it. It was like slave labor, but they’ll never admit that. They called them the People’s Chinese Army, but I found out later after reading quite a few articles on it. So these guys would … If they went that way, they didn’t go up the hill. They’d get shot by their own officers, so they had no choice. They’d come up and try to kill us, and it was a bloodbath, really, because we had flame guns, 30-caliber machine guns, and everybody had a rifle, and we had hand grenades. We’d be throwing hand grenades down, and one thing about the Chinese, though, they had a … It wasn’t a bad habit. It was a good habit of, they tried to get all of their dead before daylight. They’d take them back, and you go out in the morning, you see the odd guy on the barbed wire bleeding and bullet holes in them and all that stuff, but that was their method. They just kept … The Chinese would send them in knowing that there’s going to be high casualties, so I always felt sorry for the Chinese because I had one guy in here from China, and he was injured, we interviewed for the newspaper article, and I asked him. I said, “By the way, did the Chinese people understand how much, how many innocents were slaughtered because of the people’s, their commanders?” And he said, “Well, it’s getting better,” he said. Maybe he was a higher. Maybe he didn’t want to say it, yet I know it, but I tried to tell him. I said, “Well, you guys got slaughtered up there.” Nobody will know how many Chinese got killed. It was probably over a million. Can you imagine a million people just slaughtered? And it was tough. Especially, you had two problems. Well, actually, you had five or six, but three good ones: It was mosquitoes and the heat in the summer and the unbelievable cold of the winter coming down from Siberia. It’s 25 below zero, and you’re laying in the ground there like this. And I read an article one time where once the Chinese got really involved, and they pushed the Americans back on the east coast of Korea, one of the Americans, he wrote in this book. He said, “We went to the Chinese positions,” and they’d be laying there like this, the Chinese young recruits. They’re probably 16 years old, maybe younger. And he said, “The only way we knew they were alive is, we could see their eyes glisten sometimes.” So they would pick them up and try to save them, but I guess a lot of them never made it. So, anyway, that’s the way it was. It was like you imagine, 25 below. The Americans are retreating, the Chinese on that side and on this side. Once, they were surrounded, even, but they persevered, and the marine corps got a big name for that. They backed up, and they saved the army, and at that time, MacArthur got fired, I think. But the armistice came, and there was unbelievable euphoria. You’re still alive. You’re still alive, but you weren’t going home, like in my case, in over another year. More than a year, I had to stay. So they pulled us back from the front lines. They signed an armistice, but, see, a lot of people aren’t aware of this. The people that signed the armistice, they signed it for 3 months only. Not 3 months only, they signed it, but it had to be ratified 3 months later by higher-ups, and they told us that, so we had to move back a mile and a half from the front lines. The Chinese did the same thing. So 3 months later, we had our positions, and we only had 70 men to accompany instead of 120. We were really low, so I said to myself, “Well, if the war starts again, there’s no way I’m getting out of here.” So we had to stay there. In the meantime, back across … The Imjin River was 5 miles away. On the other side of the Imjin, the allies, Americans, Canadians, everybody, they were building these huge bunkers in preparation that maybe the war would resume. You’ve got to understand that we’re here. They’re back here, millions of Chinese up there, and then, when was that? July, August, September, October 27th, Sergeant comes up to me. He says, “You, you and you,” bring the same gun and a radio on my back, and the two other guys, he says, “Okay, you want you to walk 2 miles out in no-man’s-land, and if you hear anything, you’re supposed to radio through,” and it was a black, black night that night, cold. So we walked, and we walked, and we figured we were out 2 miles, but the war hadn’t started. The spring wasn’t going to stop anyway, and midnight came, 1 o’clock. So at 1 o’clock, if you don’t see anybody or hear anything, radio in as all okay, so 1 o’clock comes. I had the radio, “All clear out here.” He says, “Okay, guys. Come back in.” So we’d come back in again, and like I said, the war … If they had came again, there’s nothing we could do, maybe fire a few shots and got killed or something. But anyway, it was a terrifying night, and we got through that. It wasn’t too bad except the winter was coming. The winter, I mean winter, 25 below 0, and so we had to … Instead of living in the ground, we’re going to live in tents. They call them marquee tents. You’ve probably seen them, sleep about 11 people. And so we’re digging in the side of the mountains. I’m a small man. I couldn’t do heavy work, but I was doing it, trying to dig, flatten a place inside of a mountain. We’d put a tent, had to make a kitchen area. I’ll never forget long as I live. I’m working just like you see in the movies, those prisoners in Georgia with the balls on and all that stuff, and the sergeant comes down, marching down. “Anybody here a carpenter?” I heard him yell that. Swear to God, my arm just went up by itself. Put my arm up. He said, “Okay, you’ll do.” But I already had worked in a machine shop, and I knew a little bit about blueprints, and that kind of saved me. So he told me, said, “Okay, you stop digging now.” He said, “You’ve got to” … They had these prefab lumber come in, shipped in from Japan or United States, and they’re all sitting there, and there’s blueprints. And he said, “Okay, you set all that up,” and I was in heaven then because I wasn’t digging, backbreaking work. So actually, I didn’t do bad. I had to lay an area about from that window out to my back yard there and cement it all. I never cemented before in my life. He said, “Can you do that?” I said, “Yeah, I can do that,” so we got the cement and mix it with the log. We put a square area around with the wood, and I just filled it up like the Italians did when they first came to Toronto because they almost built some of those back in the ’50s. And so that worked out that way, so it wasn’t bad, but still, you had to build it and put the tents up and go on sentry duty every night, and 4 hours on, 4 hours off and stuff like that, and there were infiltrators around too. I captured a Korean, a North Korean or a Chinese prisoner of war. I shouldn’t say I captured him. He surrendered. We had an outpost. We’re sitting on the outpost, and he told us later, he said he had been there for 2 days crawling back and forth. I guess he was scared. How was he going to approach us? So one day, he just comes out like this, and I wrote a poem about that too. I’ll give you that. I’ll e-mail it to you, like Merry Christmas. It was around Christmastime. He comes out like that, and we had rifles on him, and the poem says that the brain will say, “Shoot, shoot, shoot,” but he had a smile on his face. You knew he was a prisoner. Not a prisoner, a deserter from the other side, and we didn’t shoot, thank god, because I probably wouldn’t be here today. We didn’t shoot, and he had a smile on his face, and I say that in the poem. It was quite moving, and he comes down. We take him up to the outpost and call up the captain. They come up, and they take him to this shack that they had there, and we go inside, and, my god, we had a can of peaches about that big that we had in the kitchen, and we opened that up. You just wouldn’t believe it. He was out there. Maybe he was there for a week. Who knows? And he started eating that, and the captain said, “Get away from him! Get away from him!” I said, “Why, why?” He said, “Oh, he’s probably full of lice and all that stuff.” It didn’t occur to us because he seemed to be quite jovial once he came in and got to eat and wasn’t shot and got a meal. So in that poem, I say how, at the end, “If you read this, Merry Christmas,” a long shot, but you never know. And the reason I say it’s a long shot because I was … You seen that picture of me with the Korean guy in Korea, the two of us together? They caught our picture. He had a buddy. I got another picture with him, his buddy, so I sat there, and a newspaper guy came. Oh, no. I went to a Korean newspaper, showed them the picture, and he said, “Gee, I’ll write that story.” This newspaper comes out in Korea as well as Canada, so he sent it to Korea, and sure enough, it was one in a million. I get an e-mail from that guy. He said, “I’m Kim.” His name was Kim, and apparently, what happened was, he didn’t see it in the … It was in the newspapers. His buddy had seen it and said, “Hey, Kim, that looks like you,” and he showed it to him, the picture of him with me, and so I made contact with him. I lost contact the last 2 years. Well, it’s a small world. Now, to suggest that that prisoner of war is ever going to receive that thing is really a long shot, one in a million, but his life was in our hands. But we were trained, like you see these movies. You turn around and you see a soldier, you shoot him right away, which is probably what he deserved because he might kill you. It only takes a split second, same with those cops in the States. When they attack a robber, a black robber or whatever he is, and he’s got something in his hand, they got a family. They got to move fast, and we just popped the rifles up like that, and I zeroed right on his head, but something told me, “No, no,” might have been a mistake in my life. Maybe two more would’ve popped up and killed us. Who knows? But we did the right thing. Thank god for that. And anyway, getting back to it. So we built these tents. We built about, oh, five tents all along. We had to make an indent in the mountain and put the tent there, and there’s a road coming in and a road coming out, and I built a guardhouse down below because it was snowing and raining and everything like that, so that helped. And we went through the winter like that. But strangely happened in the spring, we were out on the rivers again. We had to go out and lay in barbed wire across this field, and I might as well tell you this because it really gave me a lot of trouble later on, like PTSD. We were laying in the wire, and I looked over. There was a little gully there, and I looked over, and it was a little brook, just a trickle of water running down it, and there was … It looked like a belt buckle right in the middle of the creek, the water about that deep, clear though. And I was obviously curious anyway. I said, “I’m going over, take that belt as a souvenir.” I could see the buckle, knowing that it’s probably a Chinese belt or something. So they’re all into the wire, and the lieutenant over there. I grab the belt, and I pull it up, and up comes a body, all green and slimy, smelled like … He was underwater. He was under the ground, and so I got nauseated a little bit, so I look, and I see another one, so I pull that one up. On the side of the brook, there’s a running shoe just stuck right in the sand. I said, “Oh, well, I’ll take that home,” a souvenir, so I pull that, and there’s a foot in there, so it was another body. Fourteen, 14 bodies, and most of them had these … You ever seen Chinese troops? In maneuvers, they’ve got these, what do you call them? Mortar shells, they’re about this big. They’re bombs. You push it down, the mortar. The mortar hits the bottom, and it goes up. Well, they all had those things on their back, so this was a Chinese patrol that got wiped out probably maybe 8, 10 months ago or a year even, and I never got over that. Well, there was a reason why I never got over that. Maybe I shouldn’t tell you. It’s too gruesome. So we’re all looking for souvenirs anyway, so me, like an idiot, I took a skull. The skull was bleached clean, everything. I took the skull, and I’m going to take it home, souvenir because I had other souvenirs I had bought in Japan and so on. It was little trinkets and so on. And I took the skull back. So first of all, I go to the lieutenant. I said, “Listen, there’s bodies here. There are all kinds of bodies here,” so they had a deal. They exchanged bodies from the north to the south, so I told him. He says, “Oh, we’ll look after that,” so he gets on the blower, and I guess they scooped them all up and sent them back to North Korea. But I took the skull, and before we left Korea, we were leaving in March. Before I left Korea, you had to lay all your stuff there on the ground, and the officer would inspect it. I had swords. I had all kinds of stuff in a gift bag, and I hid the skull, and he looked. He casually looked at us all and took off. “Okay, boys. Fill it up. We’re shipping out tomorrow,” something like that, so I grabbed it, put it all in the gift bag. At the time, didn’t bother me, but when my … I’ve got a son and a daughter. When my son got 21 years old, it just hit me right in the head. I said … They exchanged the bodies like this. There’s some parent in Korea, North Korea, that didn’t get the full body, and I tried to imagine if that was my kid, and it just broke me down. It just really hurt, still does, and I guess that’s what you call the horrors of war and the people in it. But it’s strange. You go back in Korea. You felt great to be alive, but once you got married, had your own children and relate that. Say, “Well, what if that was him over there, and some Korean guy had found it and stole the skull?” And the strange part of it was, I never, ever got it. I never got the … I’m glad I didn’t. The gift bag was mislaid, and it never returned to me, so all that stuff, somebody got it. I don’t know who it is, but they don’t know the story behind it. So I guess there was lots of that stuff. Not lots, but things like that, that happened even worse in the war, and it scarred me for life. It didn’t bother me when I got out. I was drinking pretty heavy when I got out. Maybe that was why, for a few years, and then I got out of that. I got a half-decent job. I learned a trade in a machine shop. I became a foreman, but my kids were growing, and then one day, I was sitting down. I had my kid there, 18 years old, and it hit me. Just said, that could’ve been him, and some yo-yo picks up a skull and don’t return it with the rest of the body. And maybe I’m too hard on myself, but they probably got the body back, but not all of it, and it probably would … They got the body anyway, and I just wonder who those people were. It’s just … That’s one of the many things that occur in a war situation. But let’s face it, you got two groups of people. You got so-called … We used to call them groups. Every time I think about it, I get sick. They were groups. They were just like us. They had families, but I didn’t know it at the time, just later on. See, one thing about a soldier, especially who’s 19 or 18 or 20, I couldn’t figure out why we were like that, and now I found out later. The part of you, the frontal lobe in the male, doesn’t close until you’re about 30 years old, so things like that don’t bother you because you’re almost … Not a savage, but you don’t feel things like that, and in other words, I guess, most guys 35 wouldn’t go with the war because of that. They just, “Oh, yeah, I’ll survive, march up there. I’ll kill about 100 and walk away with a medal.” It doesn’t work that way, but when you’re that old, and that explains everything, the brain hasn’t processed yet, and that’s why you do silly things like that. And there was other guys probably done worse than that, but my experience in Korea was quite unique because I experienced those things. I was in a tent fire just prior to that in the middle of winter. We were all drinking, and a lot of people don’t realize that we got … Every day, we got a quart of asahi beer free, and most guys would save it up until the weekend and drink the whole seven to get drunk. And we weren’t always drunk. Don’t get me wrong, but one night, we all got drunk, and there was 11 of us in the tent, and I remember, and we had to sleep. Luckily, I always slept in a sleeping bag with my uniform on and my boots. Some guys would undress and go lay down. I said, “No, no,” because a bunch of Americans early on in the war, Americans green recruits, mostly all Blacks, at the beginning of the war. The [INAUDIBLE] come into this field and found, I don’t know. I think there was 62 or 24 Blacks with no … just their shorts on, all shot, killed. They didn’t even put a guard up. They all went in the sleeping bag with no uniforms on, and the Chinese set a trap for them and just come in and slaughtered them. So anyway, this guy, I’m just going to sleep, and I see this one guy staggering down the middle of the aisle with a candle. We all had candles, and we’d put it on a cardboard box or a wooden box, read a little bit and then snuff it out. And he went down. I was in this part of the tent. He was right down there, and about 3 o’clock in the morning, bang, bang. I hear two shots. I was drunk, but I wasn’t that drunk. I heard the two shots, and I wake up, and that whole side of the tent just blazing on fire, so I rolled out. My rifle was always right there, and I grabbed the bayonet. I sliced a hole right in the side of the tent, and we rolled out into the snow. Twenty-five below, it was, and I get out there and look around. Nobody is coming out of the tent, nobody. They’re all in there snoring away, so I … But there was reinforcements coming up the hill from the other tents. They heard the shots too. By the way, it was my buddy who was on guard duty. Good thing he didn’t go to sleep because he’d seen the flames from down in the bottom of the road. So I run back. I got back in the tent. “Come on, get out. You got to get out of here.” One guy gave me shit, said, “Oh, leave me alone! Get away! I was having a dream!” And then everybody come in the tent, and they try to come out with the sleeping bags, so that was a close call and a few guys died in the tent, tent fire because they had very primitive stoves, and like I said, you got candles. That guy got 60 days detention in Seoul, Korea, and that was a tough place to do time. He got 60 days, and I’ll never forget his name. His name was Lapont Richmond, yeah. Nice guy and all that, but he just blew it. He didn’t put the candle out, and it burned down. We had burlap like this, and it must have caught the burlap. It went right over, right up against the tent, and she went up in flames, so that was a close call there. But looking back on it now, the astonishing thing about the Korean War is the Korean people because when we left, everything was flattened. There was no civilization to speak of. There was women with kids and bongos on their head. What do you call them? What’s the word for it? Carrying that scarf thing on their head. I wrote that story about you in it. But anyway, they … Children everywhere, bawling and crying, and people with one leg and one arm, and you look back, and then all of a sudden, when I seen the first pictures of Seoul on the Internet, the modern Seoul, I just couldn’t believe it. In 40 or 50 years, whatever it was, that they could build from that rubble to a city, more modern than Toronto. All the lights were there, the glitter and everything. You’ve seen the pictures, I guess, or you’ve been there. And you feel good about that, that somehow, as low as they were and downtrodden because they had internal fights, too, in South Korea, economies against the right wing and the left wing and Syngman Rhee and all that stuff. It was like a bloodbath, and to see them rise out of there. But the only sad thing that’s left is the … I’m what you call a … You got to hit them before they hit you, and the biggest mistake that the world has made so far, and I got to blame Obama for this one. They didn’t, they haven’t, or they won’t knock out North Korea because one of these days, they’re going to bomb Seoul, nuclear, or the United States if they don’t stop them. What I would’ve done, the first time you put a missile on the pad, I’d knock it out. It wouldn’t hurt anybody, just blow it out, and the next one and the next one, but now it’s gone too far. He’s got the missiles with the help of China and every other weird country in the world, and if we don’t take him out, he’s … See, the West has got a problem. Pearl Harbor is an example. The Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor, which was a good thing in a way because it stirred up the people. They went in, and they wiped out Japan, just wiped it out. They nuked them twice, and that sounds cruel, but it was absolutely necessary in my opinion, the way I think, anyway, because the enemy is the enemy, and you’ve got a weapon, you’ve got to use it. So Japan paid the price. They attacked Pearl Harbor. Plus, they had this emperor, Hirohito. People are so naive to think that somebody could be divine, just like Omecha the Divine, the divine right of kings, for example, but I don’t believe that. I don’t bow to any man or any woman on the face of the Earth, none, none. I don’t bow to any of them, not because they’re cruel or nothing, because they’re just like me. Like Trump now, he’s president. Well, he’s still like me, but he might not be like me because if I was him, I’d push the button. I’d give him heck in a moment. I’d say, “Look, you’ve got 10 days to smarten up, or we’re going to obliterate you,” and it’d be a good thing if he doesn’t. If Kim says, “No, we’re not going to. We’re going to continue.” It’d be a good thing if he says no. Then you push the button, and you obliterate. You wait for those big plays that they have, the big amphitheater, all the generals there with all the medals and Kim. That’s the day you attack. One missile, boom, they’re gone, and all these other countries, it sends a message, like Iran, for example. Pretty soon, they’re going to be there, and our only hope there is the Jews because the Jews got to survive, and I know they’ve got plans to be prepared. They don’t want to be wiped out, you know what I mean? But I’m talking like an extraordinary hawk, but that’s what it’s going to take, and if it doesn’t, here is the alternative. He’s going to put one on Seoul and destroy, I don’t know, 3, 5 million people plus the city, or he’s going to hit Seattle or California or somewhere like that, and then, we’re going to act, but why wait for a clown like that? And that’s what war has got to be. You have to. When you see this thing coming, and the guy says it himself, you have to do it. You have to act while you can because if you can’t, millions on this side are going to die unnecessarily, and it could’ve been prevented, but then everybody says, “Oh, no. We can’t do that. We can’t do that.” Well, we can do that, and if I were to become president, I would do it. I guarantee it.

>> So …

>> But anyway, getting back to Korea, it was a very, very unique experience, and …

>> Let’s talk about when you came back and what you feel about … In a nutshell, if you want one thing or a couple things that the world not only Canadians like Sean but the world, or Koreans like me around the world, would like to know about Canada’s unique contributions to this war, what would that be? Because I know you were extremely proactive and instrumental with Canada’s Veterans Association as well as building the wall, so I know you’re very knowledgeable about Canada.

>> Yes. The only thing about Canada is, Korea was lucky because the liberals were in power then, and the liberals never did like the military, even today with Justin Trudeau, and his father was the same. His father was kicked out of office because he was mixed in with the … He didn’t believe in going to be cannon fodder for the … to fight Hitler. He didn’t want to fight Hitler, and he didn’t. His son is the same way. He didn’t want to bomb ISIS. Okay? He’s getting new Air Force plans. I got a special newsletter about it sent out to certain friends. Not everybody because they might shoot me, and he doesn’t want to bomb ISIS. Now, he’s getting new aircraft, so …

>> Who was the prime minister when the Korean War broke out?

>> It was Mackenzie King, but fortunately, he died a day before the … a day or two or a week before the cabinet made the decision to send troops there, and the leader at the time was Lester Pearson, and he went with the United Nations and said, “Yes, we’ll contribute,” but Mackenzie King wouldn’t have, in my opinion. He just hated wars. The liberals got a thing about that. They don’t like the military, and the conservatives, they’re okay, they understand. If we don’t fight them there, we’re going to fight them on our shore, so … But Canada, yes, Canada did well under the circumstances, and … But, see, they were lucky, the Koreans. They were lucky that there was thousands and thousands of young guys like myself. Like, I lived in a coal-mining town and went down like father, like son. I was 135 pounds when I was 18 years old, and these miners were big guys, real big, 10, 12 hours a day in the pit. In other words, a lot of people were unemployed, had nowhere to go, and luckily, I was one of the very few that went to high school. Just by chance, the poverty we were in, I had to buy books. Thirty-nine dollars it cost, used books, grade 10. My mother borrowed the money off our grocer, and that kind of saved me. It put me up another level, but we were all out of work, and the call came. “Let’s go. Let’s go to Korea. Sounds good.”

>> So how does Canadians remember the Korean War? What do you do at the … Is there a remembrance? Hi, I’m so sorry. We’re recording an interview. It’s okay. We’ll cut that part off. Yeah.

>> Yeah, well, that’s the sad part. The Canadians, it’s right there. You’ve probably seen this in America, the Forgotten War. This was the Forgotten War. So when we come back from the war in Korea, the war had been going for 3 years, and it got headlines. Every once in a while, they’d say, “So many killed in Korea” and so on, but the public never ever grasped it. They never did. They were tired of World War II. It’d been over for 5 years, and we come back. There was the odd little parade, but we were ignored. Didn’t bother me that much, but a lot of the guys, it really hurt, and they organized. That’s why you’ve got the Korean Veterans Association. They organized like that, and then they went to the present governments and said, “Listen, you got to do something. We’ve got to be recognized,” so the result of that was Johann Martin, the senator from British Columbia. He passed a bill in the House of Commons. We got our Korean War Veteran’s Day, July 27th every year. It’s in perpetuity, so we got that. We got another medal. We also got more understanding from the Department of Veteran’s Affairs. I had to go there when I had the PTSD, and I was successful, and I presented my own case because I was a union president at one time, and I knew enough about grievances, et cetera, and the veteran’s affairs, I’ll give you one example. This house here is typical of a house that a veteran would have after working all his life. Well, the veteran’s affairs, they come up with a VIP program, and what they do is, they cut you around. They clean up your gutters, and they shovel your snow because, well, you’re in your eighties, and they give you that money, and you have to hire the people to do it, so they treat us really good, but at the beginning, it was forgotten, but we didn’t mind because we were looking for a job, working our ass off, trying to raise a family, and it didn’t bother you. But when you started getting a little bit older and wiser, you started saying, “Hey, there’s something wrong here.”

>> And then you put that book together. Can you show this camera and just briefly show what you put together in the book?

>> Yeah. This here is the Korean War Book of Remembrance. The original exists in Ottowa, but it’s a large, large volume, and what I did was, I took all those names. There were practically unreadable. I had to retype most of them, but the photos of the Wall of Remembrance, I took those photos. Took me about 2 years to figure out what I was going to do, and it’s still in process, by the way. This is more or less a prototype, and on here is the picture of all the plaques. Now, these plaques exist in the Commonwealth grave in South Korea in Pusan, so like the Korean’s Veteran’s Day, they raised $300,000 and built the Wall of Remembrance in Brampton, and this is an example of what it looks like, and there’s 516 names there, and we paid for all of it. It took us a while. A lot of good men put their brains into it and their brawn, and we were very successful. It’s probably … It is the biggest monument in Canada for the Korean veterans, and we’re quite proud of that. Actually, it’s sacred ground. It’s in Brampton, Ontario, and I’ve got two friends of mine that are on the wall. One lived on the same street as me. He went overseas 6 months prior to me, and he was killed on Hill 355, and one other friend, maybe two or three streets over, he was with him at the same time. They both got killed the same night, and that was quite a shock to me because I knew them quite well. I went to school with them, and it kind of hit home then that the dangers were there. And nevertheless, we joined up and took a train across Canada, which I had already hitchhiked across twice. I went again down to Seattle, and we got the Liberty ship and sailed across the Pacific. It took 21 days, and horrible, horrible storms, and there was Americans on there from Southern Georgia and all that, and it was unbelievable how seasick they would get in those storms. As a matter of fact, even I got sick, and I was born on the ocean, but the seasick was rampant. Some guys, they didn’t eat for 5 days, just couldn’t eat because it was too rough. But we made it, and then we had to return same way, by ship. We left Incheon, was it? Most likely it was Incheon, sailed to Japan and then took a ship from Yokohama back to Seattle, and I remember Seattle very vividly because with the Americans, it was a little bit different. There was more Americans in the war than Canadians, obviously, and we parked off the dock, and in the morning, there was thousands and thousands of American citizens with placards, saying, “Welcome home, Johnny,” et cetera, et cetera, and bands playing, and so we all marched off the ship, and the one thing I’ll never forget is, they had the Red Cross there, and as we marched by, they had a carton of milk. I hadn’t had milk in over a year, and some cookies, and that was the greatest gift. I just couldn’t believe it, the taste of it. It was just unreal after eating C rations and anything you could get your hands on. It was basically, we were starved, too, anyway, but she gave me that little carton of milk and two cookies, and I tasted it, and it was cold, and it was beautiful. I was on my way. I’ll never forget that. It was unbelievable.

>> Well, Grandpa Bill, as I shared with other grandpas yesterday, I’m here because I want to, on behalf of all the Koreans around the world, as you said, South Korea now, thanks to your contributions, is a very successful, prosperous nation, and we enjoy the freedoms that people living in this free world get to enjoy as well as John and all of you who defended South Korea, the peninsula, from the threat of communism, so I’m here to say thank you for my life and literally, I wouldn’t be sitting here with you if it weren’t for you, and I hope that not only Canadians but Koreans and just people all over the world will not forget, and I’m hoping that in your lifetime, our lifetime, very soon, that the entire Korean peninsula, both North and South Korea, because as you know, there are many people suffering in North Korea.

>> Oh, yeah.

>> Oh, yes, that we would all enjoy this free world. So if you can look right here into the camera and speak to the Korean people, what … Yeah, the message that you want to say as someone who saved us and someone to whom we’re grateful to, right here.

>> Well, to the Korean people, all I can say is one thing. I’ve never seen such bravery, I guess. I don’t know what you could call it, resilience to survive, and we, as Canadian veterans, Korean War veterans, dearly respect and always will respect that resilience that you showed, and to be quite honest with you, I’ve talked to a lot of veterans. Like Hannah says, we fought against communism. They are of the opinion that they would do it again, even now. I would go back now if necessary. They wouldn’t take me. I know that, but that’s the way I feel. Somebody has got to do it. It’s as simple as that. I don’t know if it comes from inside you or your life experience or what, but I have no compunction about stopping communism, none whatsoever, and I would do it again, go back again. That’s all I can say, and you’re a wonderful people. I see lots of you. Your parents have emigrated to Toronto, and I admire the youthfulness, the cheerfulness that you experience in Seoul, especially when I go to certain events. And keep your heads up. You’ve done a marvelous job, and always think of your parents, that they’re the ones that suffered the most, and they suffered. And I’m proud that I could serve. Okay?

>> Thank you.

>> Okay.

>> Thank you so much. Thank you so much.

>> Thank you.

>> My name is Victor Fini. I served in Korea. I went over in 1952. I was there from 1952 to 1953. I was there approximately 14 months. I was a replacement from a first battalion, and I landed in Busan. That’s the first place we landed in, and before I got there, we sailed from Seattle, Washington, and that’s where we landed, in Busan. And then from Busan, we went up to the front at that time. We went up in freight cars. [INAUDIBLE] when I went over there, I was in advance party, which was 65 [INAUDIBLE] it was very rough going over there early. An awful lot of them got seasick from the water. The ocean was just up and down, like a bubble. And we went up, up in the front, we were up there for about 2 months, and then the rainy season started. And when the rainy season started, we moved. That’s when we moved back to Incheon for approximately 2 weeks. Then after the 2 weeks, then we went back up to the front again, and from then, I was up there until September of 19 … in ’52, and then I a transferred to transport, and then in transport, I was … My job was, at that time, was driving a cadre around, and we had to go up to the front every so many days to see if there was … How the troops were doing and which I’d lose someone while I was up there. And whatever else you want to know, I lived in it. For what we had to live in there at that time, I always kid people and say it was like a motel, but what it is is a square hole in the ground, 6-by-6, and there was an awful lot of rats in that part of the country at that time, and also, I seen where we was, and when we had to go up there, the roads were very dusty, and they would see you, enemy would see you coming, and they would try to knock you off with … They see the dust, and then they try the mortar and see if they can they can knock you off. By the grace of God, I was always safe, and that’s my interview.

>> By the grace of God, you were protected, but thanks to you, here I am.

>> Thank you.

>> My name is Duncan Finney, and I spent 14 months in Korea. I was attached to the Signal Corps. I was in Sig Corps attached the 81st Field Regiment, and I ride in Korea in ’52 and came home shortly after the ceasefire. I’ve been very involved in the Korean Veterans Association and have been back to Korea a few times, and I’m amazed at how much the country has progressed and how it looked the last I was back in 2013 and feel very proud for you people, for you have accomplished so much.

>> Well, what do you want younger Canadians and young generations of Koreans all around the world, what do you want them to remember of this war? How do you want them to remember this war and the Korean War veterans?

>> Well, I guess same as my own children. They know about the war, and they are grateful that Canada participated in the help of South Korea, and I’m sure your children will do the same too, and they should have that privilege and not have that dividing line between South and North.

>> Now you took me to the memorial earlier and showed me the names of your comrades who never made it back home.

>> Yes.

>> And I know the association, many of the grandpas worked hard to get that memorial built.

>> Yeah.

>> What do you feel when you go there?

>> Well, I know about the fact that we lost 516 guys, and our association has been very strong in letting the families know that we support them and let the government of Canada understand that when we put that wall up, because we really didn’t get any assistance from the government at all, and Bill Allen was the one that spearheaded this, and Dave was on the committee, seven or eight guys who formed the committee, and they did a darn good job, and we have had a number of dignitaries from the Canadian government. They’re proud to go there and see it, and they know what we accomplished. When I was there in ’52, there wasn’t much there and how much the country has progressed, unbelievable. It makes you happy to think that you were a part of it.

>> Well, I can tell you that not only the country of Korea but the people of Korea and Koreans all over the world, including me, and that’s why I’m here today, and my friends and family, are all grateful to you. Thank you.

>> Thank you. It was a pleasure. Maybe some day our paths will cross again.

>> Oh.

>> I’m going to go to Korea some day, but you’re living in the States now, in LA?

>> In Washington DC.

>> Oh, Washington, I haven’t been down there for a while, but I did see the monument they have down there.

>> It’s beautiful.

>> We have more of an augment. It’s a duplicate of one that they have in Korea. All right.

>> Well, thank you so …

>> December 1952 is when I found out I was going to Korea, so New Year’s Day, I pulled out of Canada to go to Korea [INAUDIBLE]. So we’ll skip all that stuff. We’ve been over that. Anyways, when I was there, my job was sample. [INAUDIBLE] for their CHA. My job was to fix the line from the TAC headquarters to the OP, observation post, 6-5 and 7-5 OP. We used to have to go through this road that they had. It was a camouflaged road. Most people call it that. I call it Whizbang Alley because every time a shell landed there, all you hear is the whizzing of shrapnel flying all over the place, and the Chinese had a different tactic. Most artilleries, like have been in two wars, most artilleries have a nice pattern when they drop their shells and when their guns fire over. The Chinese didn’t. They’re always [INAUDIBLE] all over the place, so after a while, you get used to their idea. You know there’s going to be four rounds coming in somewhere. You don’t know where but somewhere, and this one time, they fooled us. They only had three, so we waited for the longest time to see when the fourth one is going to come in, so being in the artillery, you know that they always had four [INAUDIBLE]. So that’s fine and dandy. So we found out the next day they only had three, and the day after we found we had four [INAUDIBLE]. Two days before the attack of 187, we were going through this camouflaged road, what I called Whizbang Alley, and four rounds come in at exactly a perfect pattern. Don’t get me wrong. The Chinese are deadly on their computer. They have mortars that are really good, but anyway, they’re deadly, and we couldn’t figure this out because other than that, they’re all over the place. In fact, they give the false information or false feeling that they couldn’t hit the boards out of a barn door if they’re standing on it. That’s the way we felt like, but we know better after, so the day of the attack, we moved into one place. Oh, pardon me. The lines were out on the [INAUDIBLE] thing there, and our job is to fix these telephone lines and [INAUDIBLE]. I was fixing [INAUDIBLE] on the line. That’s when we found out some of the flairs were going up at night, and you took a pink sky, everything, pink sky, so we watched that, and one of the guys from the infantry told us, “We want you in this trench over here,” so we went over to that trench there. So we went in that trench area artillery [INAUDIBLE]. When I joined the artillery, I was supposed to be behind the lines, not in front of the lines. I ended up on the front lines. I don’t know how, but anyway, just like anything else I do in my life, it’s always backwards, but anyway, we were on the front lines. Now all I can tell you is what I seen and what I did, and most of the time I forgot, and I can’t remember what it is myself, and I really couldn’t care less. That’s the way I feel about it. There was an attack. The first shock is when I first seen my first enemy. It’s kind of a shock. Even though I was trained for it, it’s still there, but I caught myself into that time, fine and dandy. That was the first shock. After firing, I took that kind of … It looked like a wall of Chinese coming at you after the first shock of this trench and put that wall out [INAUDIBLE] they would wall back up again because they come in hordes. The next shock I had, I kind of had good therapy [INAUDIBLE] and they asked me different things what you might see over there, and one thing I brought out, I says, “With all the noise going on, the machine guns going and firing bombs and all other kind of stuff going on, the loudest noise you ever have is the click of a rifle when it’s empty.” So now, they’ve got a brand-new soldier. Anyway, that was the first time I got the first sign of fear go right through my body, but once again, you’re trained. I went down. There’s enough ammunition on this [INAUDIBLE]. I reloaded, fired. Okay, second time that happened, I knew what to do. I was okay, but that was the first two shocks I had, scared me was the first enemy I’ve ever seen, the first time I run out of ammo and stuff like that. What happened after that, I couldn’t tell you. All I know after a while, we run out of ammo, and I was on top of the trench until somebody had me by the leg and said, “Get back in the trench again,” so I got back in the trench again. Lucky thing I did because our machine gun behind us opened fire and cleaned house for us. So I got back in the trench, fine and dandy. So 2 days later, we had another line crew come up and relieve us to go for a shower. So anyway, shouldn’t do that. Anyway, we went for a shower, and that’s the time when I come across … I didn’t I had it. I didn’t feel it. I had bruises on my arm and bruises on my leg. I don’t know where it come from, how it got there, didn’t have a clue. So after the shower, we come back, and we’re told we were not going back on the front line. We were going back to the regiment [INAUDIBLE]. So I got back there, and I went on [INAUDIBLE] and told them about my bruises. They asked if I was drunk or what I was drinking to get these bruises, and I says, “I never had a drop of liquor in my mouth for 2 weeks or 3 weeks.” Nobody gets that many bruises and he’s sober, so I tried to explain that we were in the middle of a battle, so what happened there, I couldn’t tell you, so that’s about all, nothing much. You’ve probably heard that story 1,000 times, so there’s nothing much to it. That’s all I can tell you.

>> What do you wish for the Korean people and the current future of Korea?

>> I’m going to tell you something that I tell everybody, and a lot of other Korean veterans agree the same. They always classify us as heroes.

>> I’m so sorry. I’m so sorry. Can we be quiet a little bit? Sorry.

>> They always classify us for being heroes, going halfway across the world and doing war. Our heroes, what I see that are heroes is the ROK Army. They fought all 3 years in that battle. They come home and rebuild the country from dirt up, and there you go. That’s my hero.

>> Well, you’re my hero.

>> Sorry. I’m sorry. I shouldn’t do this.

>> Thank you so much.

>> I’m sorry.

>> I’m sorry.

>> I’m sorry. I don’t know why, but I should never do this.

>> I would think that they are tears of joy and pride because what you have sacrificed for … Look at us.

>> Yeah, well …

>> Now look at us. Look at me. Look at my friend. Look at Koreans all over the world. We’re enjoying freedom today. You should be proud.

>> Well, after 65 years, you think it should be nothing near, but every so often it hits me. I don’t know why and no reason for it to me, but that’s it. So sorry.

>> Grandpa, done?

>> Yep.

>> I love you. Thank you.

>> Yep, yep.

>> My name is Michael Bladen, and I went to Korea with the Royal Canadian Navy. I was there from 1954 until 1955, and basically, our job was to patrol up and down the coast to make sure that nothing was going, nobody was intruding on ROK land or sea area, and one of our major things that we did was to take clothing and provisions to the islands that were isolated by the Korean War. So that was a large part of what we did, and we used to darken ship and patrol every night, and essentially during the day, we were there 2 weeks at a time, and then 2 weeks we would go into rehab in Hong Kong or Japan, any one of those places, and then back in for 2 more weeks, so it was each time. And then that essentially was what our job was.

>> So you’re telling me that you were in Korea after the armistice?

>> After the armistice, that’s correct.

>> Not a lot of …

>> They were still fighting in early part of the ’54 though.

>> Not a lot of people know that.

>> Not a great deal, but it was sort of back-and-forth skirmishes but …

>> My name is Chester Brennan. I joined the [INAUDIBLE] went to Korea in 1951.

>> What do you most remember about it?

>> Lots of things about it, really. I remember riding the train from Busan up to near the 38th parallel. I remember it being hit by bullets, windows blowing out of it, and my first year was on Hill 355, and then, from what I understood, that my unit was at the point with the line going across Korea, and it was a very important position. If they got behind us, they got behind everybody, so we really worked hard to hold that position, and I was in a few real tough battles up there. We had an old post call back from [INAUDIBLE] that was it pretty hard during the day by the North Koreans, and I went over there at 3 o’clock in the afternoon and rescued three live guys, went back out and found three buried guys, and rescued them as well, all in the same afternoon, in broad daylight.

>> You have so many medals.

>> Yeah, it seems like every time I turn around, somebody is giving me another one, and I went from 31255, Hill 355, and I was moved from there over to a place called the Hook. I was on the Hook for 2 or 3 months, and I was in a couple major battles there, and then I moved to 187, and we had a terrible couple of battles there. We lost 40 of our boys in one night on 187.

>> And there’s a Korean War memorial, Wall of Remembrance, and I know there are names of those who were killed in Korea engraved.

>> I have them all listed on my briefcase, every one of them.

>> I saw that. I saw that, and you must recognize a lot of the names there.

>> I served behind the lines, where I knew all those guys. I was on 355. About 10 o’clock in the morning, we had a guy on the stretcher by the name of Bradshaw. We had a [INAUDIBLE] on the front, and the corporal, he was on the front, a lance corporal on the back and me on the back, and a shell hit the [INAUDIBLE] and killed three of them. I got blackened but didn’t get hurt, so somebody was looking after me, I guess. I don’t know.

>> Well, I’m sure God was looking out for you, and you see the names on the walls, and they all died, but you see South Korea, the prosperous nation that she is, and Koreans all over the world know, whether Korean Canadians, Korean Americans, like me, we’re so grateful. What do you feel when you see that?

>> See?

>> Korea, Koreans, what do you feel?

>> Well, I was there, and it brings back memories, brings back memories of what I did, what I went through. I’ve been decorated several times by the presidents of Korea. I did that big [INAUDIBLE] the big stone downtown [INAUDIBLE], and I went to … They called me to a big special meeting in Toronto with Korean people. They decorated me with that, and it really … It’s something else, really.

>> What do you hope for the future of the Korean people, or …

>> I hope they don’t go through it again. When I was there, there was nothing for them. Seoul is not the Seoul that I went through there, and there was kids with no clothes. People come along and beg you for something, to give them a pair of socks or something, and they were … They had nothing that they needed. They needed clothes, and it was a very sad situation. The only highlight I got at all, there was a little boy, we called him Willy, RCR Willy, and I was with him when he was just smaller than him, and he came to Canada with me, and he’s in Canada now. RCR Willy is what his name is. He’s in Canada, and he was just a little guy, and we rescued him. He was all by himself and nobody to take care of him, so we took him with us, and he’s in, I think, he’s in Ottawa here, a little Ottawan [INAUDIBLE] RCR Willy.

>> How did you guys meet again?

>> We just happened to run into each other, and I just got talking. When I heard his name, I said, “Kid, are you RCR Willy?” “Yeah.” He said, “I know you.” “Yeah, I know you, too.” We rescued him. We named RCR Willy because I was RCR, Royal Canadian Regiment, we named him RCR Willy. He’s in Canada somewhere now, in Ottawa somewhere.

>> And he kept his name?

>> What?

>> He kept his name Willy?

>> RCR Willy.

>> Wow.

>> Yeah, he’s in Ottawa somewhere.

>> That must have been very emotional.

>> What?

>> That must have been very emotional.

>> Oh, yeah, yeah, he was quite a little guy.

>> Well, I can guarantee you there are many, many Koreans all over the world enjoying the freedoms and success that we are thanks to your sacrifices.

>> Mm-hmm.

>> Thank you.

>> Yeah.

>> Hello. My name is Arthur Campbell. I went to Korea in February 1952. I left for Korea in February. I landed in Korea in March of 1952. It took us a month to get from our camp in Ottawa, Ontario. It took us a month to get over to Korea. They put us on a terrible ship. It must have been made in Japan or China back in the day because it broke down halfway across the ocean.

>> The ship broke down?

>> The ship broke down.

The big propeller stopped propelling, so thank God it had a little propeller on it, which kicked in, but consequently because we used the little propeller, it took us twice as long to get us across the ocean, which was not very nice. It was not very nice, but we made it. We landed in Japan. We stayed at the dry docks in Japan for about 3 days until they finished the ship. Then we went on to Korea. I liked Japan. It was very nice. It was occupied at the time, being so close to the Second World War. They didn’t know it was still occupied, and the occupation troops that were there were Australian, nice guys, big. They were all 6-foot-2, 6-foot-3, but they had the bad habit of thinking that the occupied Japan, that we weren’t allowed to touch anything. Excuse me. I won’t be vulgar, but we were all young guys, and we liked girls. So we would go to the dance hall.

You would buy a ticket, and the ticket would allow you to dance with a girl. We spent a lot of money on tickets. I did. Then, while you’re dancing, a big Australian would come along and say, “I’m cutting in,” and, “No, you’re not.” So we had a lot of arguments with the Australians, but we still had a girl. Then we moved on to Korea, and it was terrible. It was terrible. People were poor. The cities … It was awful. It was the most … I shouldn’t be doing this. I never went back. I had two or three chances to go back, but it just bothered me so much. I’m not over yet. When you were talking when you first come in, you were talking about … because of the troops that were there, United Nations, not just Canadians, United Nations, and because of them, you, your brothers, sisters, aunts, uncles are here now. That’s true. That’s very, very true because the amount of children, fatherless children, wonderful ladies that were just doing anything to keep their kids. It was terrible. So I’m proud. I’m happy about that, but I’m not going to get into anything as far as the terrible things that happened.

I can’t do it, and I won’t.

>> Then how about, so back here in Canada, you’re very active in the Association. What are some of the things that you’ve been doing as part of the Association to ensure that Canadians don’t forget?

>> What I have done, because I am the youngest, and thank God I’m still in fairly good physical condition, and I’m one of the few in the club. Now, Dave and I are both very good. Dave is an organizer. He can get things moving. Excuse me. I, on the other hand, am more of a hands-on type of guy. I can set up meetings. I can set up our picnics. I’m like a babysitter to most of the guys that can’t move, like I’m taking care of Ken. Ken and I are dear, dear friends. I pick him up, take him home. I take care of him. I’m sure you know that he has a little problem with dementia, and so yes.

What I do is humanitarian things, really. I love the guys. They love me. We get along together, and if I say to them, “Hey. We’re going to the Wall of Remembrance in July,” and this is January, “When?”, “19th of July,” “Okay.” They’re ready to go. I’ll make sure there’s transportation for them to and from and things like this. I’m not one to … I’m just one of the guys that can still help.

>> You’re the one behind the scenes that may move things.

>> I guess you could say that.

>> Yes, because there’s an organizer.

There’s a planner, but somebody has to do logistics.

You’re logistics.

>> Yep.

Yep.

>> Well, you said that it’s very painful for you to think about and remember it and even visit Korea because of the horrors that you’ve seen and witnessed in the war, but it is true that Korea still has not achieved peace. What do you think about that? What do you hope, maybe?

>> Well, I’ve heard that it does, so I’m terrified that that freaking idiot that they’ve got running North Korea, the little fat guy. All he talks about is bombs. I don’t like that. I don’t like him. We’re too old, but I’m telling you, if they need an instructor, there’s a lot of guys are capable. I’d go back in a blink of your eye. I would go back.

>> For to fight for Korea’s peace.

>> As an instructor. I couldn’t climb one mountain, not unless you got me a big billy goat that could carry me.

>> So you, as an instructor, you would leave your family even now to go back.

>> Right now, I have 13 grandchildren …

>> Wow.

>> … eight grandchildren, five great-grandchildren. My wife, God bless her, she passed away in 2008. She was a little girl, 4-foot-11, beautiful, beautiful, beautiful, Italian, black, black hair, brown, brown eyes, body … Oh. She was gorgeous, and then she had a stroke through diabetes. God, but thank God, she didn’t suffer. So to answer your question, I’ve got a family. I’ve got my kids, but they’re all grown up. They don’t need me anymore. They don’t need me anymore. They visit. They feed me. They phone, “How are you, Dad? Come on down Sunday,” which I do after church. I always drop in and see. But when the day comes that you’ve got no one that depends on you, really you’re taking up space. After my wife passed away, it was terrible. It was terrible, and yeah. I’d go back. I would go back. I’ve got too much involved in that country, too much of me. There’s too much of me still there. When I come home, yeah, I wasn’t the same Arthur that came home as the Arthur that went. Okay, sweetie?

>> I love you.

>> I love you, too, and you made everything … you and the thousands like you made it worthwhile.

>> Thank you.

>> Okay. Love that.

>> Grandpa Ken, when did you first go to Korea? When did you first go to Korea?

>> Why?

>> I have so much stuff.

>> Because I joined the Army to go there.

>> I have so much stuff [INAUDIBLE].

>> And when?

>> Right at the beginning of the war?

>> In 1950?

>> Yeah, in that time, in, around that time, yeah.

>> But you also fought in the World War II.

>> World War II, yeah.

>> So how old were you?

>> Sixteen and a half.

>> When you went to World War II?

>> When I to World War II, yeah. I was 16 years, 16 years old.

>> How old were you when you went to Korea? They recruited soldiers that young, when you were sixteen?

>> I guess I aged about 3 years or 4 years. I don’t know, but no. I went to Korea when I was … not Korea. I went … When I first joined the Army [INAUDIBLE] going right there. I lied like heck about my age.

>> You lied about your age?

>> Yeah. Well, see I told them I was 19.

>> Why did you want to join the Army when you were 16?

>> Sixteen, yeah.

>> You were a baby.

>> I told them I was 19, and I got in that way, and I was only 16, 16 1/2 when I got into action.

>> So when you went to Korea when you were I guess 19, 20?

>> I was about 16, yeah.

>> No, in Korea.

>> Wasn’t 16 when I went to Korea. Then I joined the Korean fun … The Korean war, I had already been in one war, and then that was my second war.

>> So how old were you?

>> Well, I started out, I was 16.

>> No, in Korea. How old were you when you were …

>> I would be about … Oh, I don’t know, 18, 19 if I was that old.

>> Okay.

>> I’m not sure of the age now. I forget everything. I do, and it’s a son of a gun. I can’t remember anything. Surely …

>> Well, you …

>> … [INAUDIBLE] stuff.

>> Well, what is your name?

>> So I spent time in World War II. Then when the Korean War broke out, I joined right up there with them.

>> What is your first … When you went to Korea, what was your first impression? What do you remember about the Korean War?

>> Korean War, well, going there and in a foreign land, foreign people to talk to and that, and it was just like anything else. You go, and you get used to it.

>> What do you remember from …

>> Well, I remember getting there and meeting other people and being ready for action, and I got wounded there, and when I back in the war again, I got wounded a second time, and nothing serious, but a wound was there. The first war I went to, I got everything, got all the paperwork done. I would sit there, and my mother said, “I’m going to have you withdrawn, tell them your age,” and I said, “Don’t bother. I’ll run away, and you won’t know where I am,” and that stopped her, so I went over there. I was in France, Belgium, Holland and all those places during World War II, and then when the Korean War broke out, I was there for that, and that’s it.

>> Have you been back to Korea?

>> I’ve never been back, no.

>> Yeah, you went back once.

>> Once, I guess, yeah.

>> Yeah, you were back once with me.

>> What year? When?

>> It was 2003, I think.

>> I forget what I was doing yesterday. I’m telling you. It’s tough.

>> We’re all getting older.

>> Yeah, damn right.

>> Getting older.

>> Oh, Jesus.

>> It’s okay. I forget too. Sometimes, I forget too.

>> I forget what I ate for dinner. You ask me what I had for lunch yesterday …

>> Exactly.

>> My name is Steve Davidson. I fought in the Korean War. I was 19 when I was in Korea. I started off as an army cadet, I guess, when I was 13 years old. I drove a tank when I was 14, and I joined the Reserve Army, which is like being in the army. You could be called in case of war, and then the Armed Forces in Canada, you had to be 18, so I joined, and I went to Korea when I was 19, and I guess I was looking for adventure. So I got to Korea, and when I arrived to Korea, it was on the 3rd of January in 1953, and when I had seen the devastation that had been caused in the country, we stayed at a staging camp in Busan for a couple of days, and then there was a troopship or a train that went forward, and it took a couple of days for us to get to Seoul or Tokchon, actually, which was the railhead where they dropped off. From then on, it was Tokchon to the no-fire zone. Along the way, there were little children. We’d stop. Some of them had their arms blown off, their legs blown off. They had no clothes. They had nothing to eat. We would take them on the train. We would give them chocolate bars and leftover sandwiches and anything we could and give them one of our jackets if we could to help, much too large for them, but to help them keep warm. So when you’re 19, you look at it and you say, “Boy.” You become a man very quickly. So my job in Korea was, I was a gun technician, a gun fitter, they called it, and I repaired weapons and artillery weapons, so it was my job to make sure that the guns were firing properly, and they fired where they should be firing and that we could kill enemy targets. I recall a battle, 197. It was a very intense battle, and that’s when Canada lost 23 soldiers in 1 day. They had only arrived from Canada. I think the Chinese realized that they were new, and they put an attack in, and it was very intense. The artillery fire was very heavy, and one of the loaders on one of the guns, he missed the breech on the gun and hit the side of the breech ring and set off the fuse, and when he’d done that, he blew himself and the gun up. My job was to repair that gun, so I had to pick flesh parts off the gun from him. The parts were very damaged. It took us 32 hours straight to repair the gun and get it back into action again because in the war, you don’t rest until the job is done.

>> That’s true.

>> Yeah, no matter how long it takes.

>> Well, that …

>> I always say, these people who would like a 30-hour work week have no sympathy for me who paid 32 hours that one day. I’ve revisited Korea twice since then. The first time was in 1984, which was 30 years after the end of the war, 31 years to be exact, and I was amazed at the progress that South Korea had made to rebuild the country from the ruins. It was devastating to see it. When I got there, it was lively, moving very quickly and buildings with high skyscrapers again. When I was there, there was one bridge across. Now, I believe there’s probably a dozen, and I was really impressed. I was national president for the Korean Veteran’s Association. In 2003 for the 50th anniversary, I went to Korea with the [INAUDIBLE] to celebrate the 50th anniversary, and I was, again, amazed. When I was there the first time, I had the okay to attend the opening of the Olympic Stadium where Seoul was holding the Olympics in 1988, and they had finished the stadium by 1984, and I was at the opening of the stadium. I thought it was just wonderful. The second time I was there, they built a war museum. In front of the war museum, there’s a big, beautiful monument, and I was amazed once again at the progress that they had made. I guess in summing that up, I was a kid looking for excitement, something different. I didn’t really know why I was there. I’ve seen the Korea of today. I know why I was there, and I’m very happy, and I guess I consider all Koreans my extended family, and my closing remark I guess would be, if you’ve been in war for 1 day, you have had enough war to last a lifetime.

>> Can you repeat that?

>> If you have been in war for 1 day, you have seen enough to last you a lifetime.

>> I know. Thank you. We are so grateful to you, the Canadian-Korean War veterans and the Korean War veterans all around the world, and as you know, there’s still an armistice and South and North Korea remain divided, so what do you hope for the future of …

>> Well, I would like to see in my lifetime them united. I had a chance in my second visit to attend the memorial service in the demilitarized zone, and the South Korean pavilion is absolutely beautiful. On the North, you have a very long building, but it’s only 8 feet wide, but I’m 6-foot-2, so I wouldn’t have much room to lay down at night, and the South has progressed while the North has de-gressed, and people are suffering from malnutrition and wasting their money on developing weapons of destruction. That’s not the way the world should be.

>> Well, I hope that in your lifetime and our lifetime, very soon, that there will be peace, and we’ll be united so that even North Koreans who are suffering will also gain freedom that we, Koreans all over the world, enjoy so much. So on behalf of my family and friends and Koreans all over the world, thank you.

>> It’s been so nice to be able to meet you, and I think what you’re doing, traveling to every country that participated in the Korean War, is certainly a big undertaking for a little lady of your stature. You’re a good representative of your nationality.

>> I may be little, but I am strong.

>> You’re mighty.

>> I am mighty.

>> Yes. That’s right. You sure are. You’re beautiful.

>> Thank you so much.

>> Okay.

>> Love you. All right. You’re so sweet.

>> Thank you so much for the warm reception. This was beautiful. Today was beautiful.

>> We tried our best.

>> Best was better than any best, better than any best.

>> But all we can do is try our best. That’s what that … So It’s been a real pleasure to have you today.

>> Grandpa Dog, Grandpa Dave, Uncle Bill, everybody, thank you.

>> A lot of people.

>> I know why I was there. I’ve seen the Korea of today. I know why I was there, and I’m very happy, and I guess I consider all Koreans my extended family, and my closing remark I guess would be: If you have been in war for 1 day, you have had enough war to last a lifetime.

>> Can you repeat that?

>> If you have been in war for 1 day, you have seen enough to last you a lifetime.

>> I know. Thank you. We are so grateful to you, the Canadian Korean War veterans and the Korean War veterans all around the world, and as you know, there is still an armistice and South and North Korea remain divided, so what do you hope for the future of …

>> Well, I would like to see in my lifetime them united. I had a chance in my second visit to attend the memorial service in the demilitarized zone, and the South Korean pavilion is absolutely beautiful. On the North, you have a very long building, but it’s only 8 feet wide, but I’m 6-foot-2, so I wouldn’t have much room to lay down at night, and the South has progressed while the North has de-gressed, and people are suffering from malnutrition and wasting their money on developing weapons of destruction. That’s not the way the world should be.

>> Well, I hope that in your lifetime and in our lifetime, very soon, that there will be peace, and we’ll be united so even North Koreans who are suffering will also gain freedom that we Koreans all over the world enjoy so much. So on behalf of my family and friends and Koreans all over the world, thank you.

>> It’s been so nice to be able to meet you, and I think what you’re doing, traveling to every country that participated in the Korean War, is certainly a big undertaking for a little lady of your stature. You’re a good representative of your nationality.

>> I may be little, but I am strong.

>> You’re mighty.

>> I am mighty. Yeah.

>> That’s right. You sure are. You’re beautiful.

>> Thank you so much. Okay.

>> Love you. All right. You’re so sweet.

>> Thank you so much for the warm reception. This was beautiful. Today was beautiful.

>> We tried our best. I …

>> Hi. I am now at the grave site of Grandpa Joseph Giahopman. He died in the Korean War. He also served in World War II, and he died in Korea in 1951. It’s kind of hard to see, but it may be that, I don’t know, maybe married to a Samoan woman, but was buried here because it says from New York, so he’s definitely not Samoan, right?

>> Yeah, probably not …

>> Just a haole. Yeah.

>> Okay. However, look at how beautiful this place. What is this called? It’s Pago Pago?

>> Pago Pago.

>> What is the water called, body of water.

>> It’s Pago Pago Harbor.

>> Pago Pago Harbor.

>> Okay, and it is beautiful. It’s not raining today anymore, but I also found something very interesting, and so I’m going to show you, so I noticed that grave marks with Korean characters. Of course, me being Korean, I’m like, “What is that? That is very weird,” and David told me … He’s with the Historical Society, tells me that the fishing industry, the tuna industry became very popular in what year?

>> In the early 1950s.

>> 1950, so that’s the …

>> Same time.

>> … same time of Korea War. Oh, my goodness, and so a lot of fishermen that came here were Korean, so when they were sending American Samoans to fighting in Korea, they were here fishing, and many of them died, so they asked for a plot of land where they could bury the fishermen, and so here they are. It’s amazing. Wow. It says Satala Korean Fishermen cemetery, “[FOREIGN LANGUAGE],” so they are all these fishermens raised here. It is so amazing, so the connection between, I guess, the Korean people and American Samoans are not just … has not ended just in terms of the Korean War, but the fishing industry because I want to give a shoutout to the StarKist Corporation, which is now owned by Cowon, and they sponsored our lunch today with the veterans, and so I’m very proud because it makes the veterans very proud knowing that they sacrificed for people who work really hard to become so prosperous and to give back and to say thank you, and so that’s why I’m here, to say thank you, and so here once again, thank you to my grandpa. I came because you didn’t return home and on this beautiful harbor and this mountain, so talofa everybody and [FOREIGN LANGUAGE] 감사합니다 and thank you. Bye.

>> We’re here to honor your uncle, and we will pray and have a moment of silence in honor of his memory. [INAUDIBLE], and can you say out really loud the name of your uncle again?

>> Mantansa Solipo Faranai.

>> This uncle died in the Korean War on August 12th, 1950, right when the Korean War started. This is her great uncle, so the relatives are here to honor them, and he’s actually one of the four American Samoans who were killed in action, one of the four, and I believe about 100, we know, are registered as enlisted from this island, so as you can see, there’s some construction going on …

>> [INAUDIBLE].

>> … that you can show because they’re …

>> Relocating.

>> Yeah.

>> Because the grave was relocated from there because they’re building a house, but you live nearby here?

>> No.

>> No?

>> Oh, but why is this grave here?

>> Well, because is this his family.

>> Oh.

>> His mother’s side is from Pago Pago.

>> Yeah, so he’s buried here not at a cemetery somewhere else because his mother is from his area.

>> This is his mother’s land.

>> And it’s a beautiful area. Look at the mountains. Yes. It is just so beautiful. What is this area called?

>> Pago Pago.

>> Oh, is this area Pago Pago.

>> Pago Pago.

>> Yeah.

>> So this is the Pago Pago village. It is a beautiful … All of you were born on this island.

>> Yes.

>> Right? Yeah, and so all of your are here to honor her, Rosie, from the Veterans Affairs office from the local … From the American Samoan Government and the [INAUDIBLE] the VFW chief [INAUDIBLE] commander, and David is with the Historical Society and films, and thank you to David. We’re all here to honor and be proud of your uncle, everyone continues to remember him because the purpose of my visit here is to let him know and let you guys know and let your entire family and all of American Samoa to know that their sacrifices have not been made in vain, and we remember, so thank you so much.

>> My name is Roy Laulusa. I’m a retired veteran. My dad passed away, and he was a World War II and a Korean veteran. His name is Tumu Pili Laulusa, and my second-to-the-oldest brother, he was a Korean veteran too. His name is Tumu Laulusa Jr., so we all, including myself, I had two tours. My first tour in Korea in ’72 to ’74. I was stationed in Daegu. My second tour of Korea, I was up at the DMZ from 1988 right after [INAUDIBLE] to 1990. I was over there. In my job in the Army, I was a weatherman in the Army. I support the Army live-fire place up there at the DMZ, and that’s our mission is fly weather balloon, so any time they want to fire live fire, we’ll be able to tell them what the weather is and everything, so I’m very proud to be a part of the veteran that served in Korea. I thank the Korean people for their hospitality and the custom I learned from Korea. Even over here in American Samoa, we have some Korean too, and they are very good people. Thank you to the Korean people.

>> Your father, what division, infantry, when did he serve? What year?

>> He was in … I don’t know what division, but he was in the Marine Corps. He was over there during the Korean War.

>> What year?

>> He was over there 1950. I think he deployed to Korea somewhere around August in 1950. He came back 1952. That’s when he came back. We were in Hawaii. Then he returned from over there. My older brother, when in Korea, is in the Air Force. He was over there too in 1950 to 1953.

>> Your older brother?

>> My older brother named Tumu.

>> He was there in 1950?

>> 1950, the later part of 1950.

>> But your father was there too.

>> My father was there.

>> Your father and your brother was there at the same time?

>> Yes, yes.

>> How is that possible?

>> I don’t know. Like me, when I went to touch the stone, me and …

>> How old was your father, and how old your brother?

>> My father was around … my father … my brother was around about … Because he’s 94 years old. Yeah. My brother is 94.

>> My father was probably, he was in the late 40 or roughly in the 50.

>> During the Korean War.

>> During the Korean War.

>> So he was older.

>> Mm-hmm.

>> Oh.

>> He was a old man.

>> Oh, my god, and he went to go to Korea when he was old? He was a officer?

>> He was a Marine, regular Marine, with a bayonet and a gun.

>> But he was over 40 years old?

>> He was over 40 years old.

>> And he went to serve …

>> Yes.

>> … with 19 years old?

>> With the 19-year-old people.

>> The military accepted him?

>> That’s why they had to let him go. When he came back, they told him, “You got to retire.”

>> Oh, my goodness, because he was a World War II veteran too.

>> He was a World War II veteran.

>> Amazing. Wow. Can you spell your father’s name for us?

>> It’s … His name, his first name is Tumu, T, U, M, U, last name Pili, P, I, L, I, Laulusa, L, A, U, L, U, S, A.

>> And your brother’s name?

>> My brother’s name is Tumu too, T, U, M, U, last name Laulusa, L, A, U, L, U, S, A, too.

>> Amazing. Thank you to all three for your service.

>> Thank you. Even right now, my whole … All my niece and nephew, most of them they serve in the military …

>> Amazing.

>> … different branch, but they serve in. I know two of my niece that they both serve Korea.

>> Amazing. Thank you so much.

>> Thank you. Thank God, that’s the most thing.

>> Thank God.

>> Thank God for the blessing and for looking after us.

>> Hi, everybody. I am here at the Veterans Affairs Department with, ta-da, my American-Samoan and Korean-War grandpas and their families, so I’m going to introduce you to them. So you met yesterday the Veterans VFW state commander, Inafo Maria.

>> Hello.

>> Aloha, right? And then the post commander, Mr. Apu.

>> Hi.

>> Okay. So here is my veteran grandpa. You can come a little closer. Your name is …

>> Suaka Shushba.

>> Yes. Grandpa Sua was in the Air Force, which is very rare, in 1950 …

>> Two.

>> 1952, so he flew to Korea carrying a …

>> Atomic bomb.

>> He carried an atomic bomb, but thank God, yeah, thank God he didn’t have to drop it, right? Yeah. If I remember correctly, General MacArthur kind of wanted to drop it, huh?

>> Wanted to drop it.

>> Yeah, but thank God that didn’t happen because Korea then would not exist today, maybe. Yes, and maybe I wouldn’t exist, so thank you for not dropping it.

>> [INAUDIBLE] protect Korea.

>> Yes. Thank you. Thank you. Look how young he looks. How old are you, Grandpa?

>> I’m 87 years old.

>> Eighty-seven, he’s looking young though.

>> He’s too young.

>> Yes. Now this is my second Korean-War-veteran grandpa with his lovely girlfriend and son, handsome son, right? Grandpa, your full name?

>> [INAUDIBLE].

>> Yes. It’s a little bit long, but for short, I will call you my Grandpa … first name …

>> Beneva.

>> Beneva, Grandpa Beneva. He has an impeccable memory, and he was a combat veteran, right?

>> Yeah.

>> He served in some of the major battles of …

>> Outpost Harry.

>> Outpost Harry with the Greeks.

>> Pork Chop Hill.

>> Pork Chop Hill. Oh, by the way, everybody, do you have the … Well, he doesn’t have it, but he’s part of the Indianhead, the second ID. There’s a lot of Indianhead people watching this. So, “second to none,” right?

>> Second to none.

>> Second to none. Yes, yes. That’s it, so thank you, and what’s your name?

>> Gilbert Fiere.

>> Okay. What does it mean for you to have a father who served in the Korean War?

>> I’m very proud of my dad. He inspired me to join the service as well, and so I’m very proud of him.

>> Where did you serve?

>> First Persian Gulf War.

>> Oh, thank you for your service too. Thank you. Okay. Well, he’s not a Koren War veteran.

>> Nope.

>> As you can see, he’s not that old, but his father …

>> Yes.

>> His father was a Korean War veteran, and your father’s name is …

>> Edwin Robert Hollister.

>> Yes. Mr. Grandpa Edwin, he too also served in Desert Storm, so we have many families. Many of the members of the family served in the military and American Samoa. Per capita, right, number one, per capita, number one, and they have the spirit of serving the country, duty freedom, right, family, protecting family.

>> Yes.

>> And so your father served what year, you said?

>> 1950 …

>> 19 …

>> … until 1953, somewhere that time.

>> Yeah, yes, and he served in the Army.

>> Army, yes.

>> Yes. Do you know what division or what …

>> No. I don’t know.

>> Yes. He doesn’t know, but he did say that his father was very proud, right?

>> Yes.

>> He died 7 years ago?

>> No, back in …

>> Oh, it was ’75, 1975.

>> ’76. He passed away in 1976.

>> Oh, 1976, but he was born in 1925.

>> Yes.

>> Oh, and he was a medic. Now it’s coming back to me.

>> He was a medic, yes.

>> Yes, he was a medic. He was a medic, so we have airmen. We have a combat veteran, and we have a medic in American Samoa in the Korean War. And this is a very special story, so I’m going to save you last.

>> Mm-hmm.

>> Ladies, best for last, but his father …

>> Uncle.

>> Uncle, I’m sorry. His uncle also served in the Korean War, and so did he, right?

>> Yes.

>> And your uncle inspired you to be tough, right? You said so.

>> Yes.

>> Yeah. Everybody was scared of his uncle and his family, he said, right?

>> Yes.

>> And what is your uncle’s name?

>> Name is Titae Fieme.

>> Yes, and we honor him and his memory. Now her uncle and her brave uncle also fought. So they’re all family here. Let’s show … What’s your name? What’s your name? She’s shy, but she’s very cute and pretty. Okay, so your uncle’s name is …

>> Masanisa Soripo Fanlan.

>> Yes, and her uncle, however, passed away, died, was killed in the Korean War.

>> Action.

>> Killed in action in August …

>> August 12th, 1950.

>> Yes, so as you remember, that was less than 2 months after the Korean War broke, and this was before the [INAUDIBLE] of MacArthur, so when your uncle fought was when the North Korean army, after invading the 38th Parallel, kept pushing down and down and down and down. So your uncle was part of the first major casualties that were suffered, and it was so touching because her family still remembers her uncle’s memory, but she never saw his picture. They don’t have a picture of their uncle, so they don’t know how he looks like, so they only remember him through the heart, and so I’m really hoping that I can find them …

>> A picture.

>> Yeah, get a picture so that they can see how handsome their uncle was, and I know your other sister is not here, but there was a song about his uncle. Can you sing that a little bit one more time?

>> I don’t know. I forgot the words.

>> Yes.

>> My sister remembers.

>> Just a little bit.

>> The word of the song, it was done by my grandmother, his mom, and the word of the song goes like this in English: “Masani, where are you? Are you sleeping, or are you awake? Please come home.” That’s it.

>> And his mom was always waiting for him to come.

>> I think because he left when he was a young man, not an old man.

>> I call her my auntie, and I’m so, so honored you’re here, and I’m here to say thank you to your family and that your uncle’s service and sacrifice is not forgotten, okay?

>> Amen.

>> Forever, and there are so many people out there who are grateful to you. I represent them. I’m here to represent everybody who’s grateful, not just by myself, okay?

>> All right. Thank you very much.

>> So thank you, everybody, and I’m just so happy to be here on this beautiful island. We still have [INAUDIBLE] to do and cemeteries to visit. We’re going to go visit her uncle’s grave later. So remember727.org. Thank you. Bye.

>> My name is [Indistinct]. I was born in [Indistinct] in the village of [Indistinct] What else?

>> When?

>> December 1st, 1929.

>> Ooh, so how old were you when you joined the Army?

>> How old was I? I think I was 22 years old.

>> Mmm, so what year did you go to Korea?

>> I believe I got to Korea in 1953.

>> Mm-hmm.

>> ’52? No, ’52.

>> What do you remember?

>> Huh?

>> What do you remember?

>> In Korea?

>> Mm-hmm. You were a rifleman?

>> Yes, I was infantry.

>> Mmm, artillery.

>> No, infantry, foot soldier.

>> Mmm.

>> Koreans are very beautiful people, good-natured people, and we got along with them very well.

>> Which division did you belong to?

>> I was in the 2nd division.

>> 2nd ID? Oh, Indianhead!

>> Indianhead.

>> “Second to none.”

>> “Second to none.”

>> “Second to none!”

>> Yep.

>> Oh, wow, you know, the Indianhead is still in Korea now.

>> Huh?

>> They still are in Korea. Indianhead 2nd ID is still in Korea …

>> Yeah?

>> … even now, yes. So did you see combat?

>> Oh, yes.

>> Oh. Do you remember any battle?

>> Pork Chop, Battle of Pork Chop.

>> You were in Pork Chop Hill? Can you tell us about that? It’s a very famous battle.

>> I was in outpost Tom, Dick and Harry.

>> Outpost Harry with the Greeks?

>> Yeah, I was in three different outposts, Tom, Dick and Harry, and I hate killing, but we had to do it [Indistinct] go to war. They’re very nice people. I think the North Koreans were nice people. Even though they were Communists, they were a very nice people.

>> Everybody had to do their job.

>> Yes. I can’t talk enough goodness about the country. The country is good, beautiful country, beautiful people.

>> You’ve been back? Have you ever visited?

>> No, never went back. Even if I had a chance to go back, I wouldn’t go back.

>> Why not?

>> Bad memories. I used to … I’ve been diagnosed with post-traumatic …

>> PTSD, post-traumatic stress disorder.

>> Post-traumatic stress disorder.

>> Because you had to kill?

>> But I did pay for that, though. That’s … little good about that, not too much good.

>> What does it … How does it make you feel now, though? Because now South Korea is very prosperous. You know?

>> Well, if I had another chance, would there be another war?

>> I hope not.

>> I hope not. Senseless killing, I didn’t like it. They’re humans like everybody else.

>> Well, I know that even if you killed somebody, you know, God understands because it was during war, and it wasn’t, you know, it wasn’t evil inside you. It was you were doing your job so that you don’t get killed. You know?

>> It’s a job.

>> Yes, and I hope you know that what you did was to defend freedom, for people like me to be born into freedom, you know, instead of Communism. I was … I’m enjoying freedom, you know, and you defended freedom for the entire world, not you alone, but many of you. Right?

>> Yeah.

>> So you should be so proud, and I hope that you find healing and peace …

>> That’s the bad part, some friends didn’t come back.

>> I know, and so I’m here to honor them, too. You’re right. Some didn’t come back, and so I came here to say thank you to them.

>>Mm-hmm.

>> Thank you. Do you have any other things that you want to talk about, maybe a story?

>> Well, it’s a very good country, very good country. They just got caught in a world event and things like that. There was no sense in it. When I come back, I decided to be a minister.

>> Oh!

>> But you know what happened when I walked in the church? All the angels flew away.

>> So did you really … Did you become a pastor?

>> Pardon me?

>> So did you really become a pastor?

>> No.

>> He was the head over our church for a little while.

>> My father is a pastor. My father is a minister.

>> Oh, yeah? Oh, good.

>> But, again, but God protected you. God loved you.

>> Yeah.

>> He saved you from the war, and He gave you blessing of health, yeah.

>> You know, it’s hard to forget the buddies that didn’t come back.

>> That’s why we have to keep remembering them and honoring them.

>> Yes, I know, and I’d like to go visit their folks, but I couldn’t, too much pain.

>> Well, thank you for your service.

>> Hi, I’m David Herdrich. I’m the historic preservation officer for the American-Samoa Historic Preservation office, and I was asked to do some research on Korean veterans from the Korean War, of Samoans who served in the Korean War, and one of the first things I found is that there’s very little information on the Internet or even the Department of Defense or with the National Archives. So when I searched the National Archives’ records, there was only one record of a Samoan who fought and died in the Korean War. I continued my search, and I did find a private Korean War remembrance website, and they listed three other Samoans who had died in the Korean War, and then I started doing research at our local archives, and the result of that research, I found close to 100 Samoans who were enlisted at the time of the Korean War. So there’s a large number of Samoans who served during the Korean War era, and then I also went to a private newspaper website, and I did searches on that website, and I found a number of newspaper articles about Samoans who served in the Korean War. Some of the newspaper articles include pictures of the Samoans, and so what we hope to do is contact the Department of Defense and the National Archives and see if they can update their records so there’s a record of the Samoans who served in the Korean War.

>> Wow. Anything specific, particular that you may have noticed in your research?

>> The one thing I’ve noticed is that some of the records that we do have are a little bit inaccurate. So even on the Korean, the private Korean website, they don’t have some of the burial locations down correctly. So we’re hoping with this research that we can update their records as well, and have an accurate picture of the service that Samoans provided in the Korean War.

>> Mm. Okay.

>> Hi. My name is [INAUDIBLE] from American Samoa.

>> Louder.

>> I retired from the US Army after serving 30 years. I’m a lieutenant colonel, and being in the military has been a great privilege for me to serve the country and also here in American Samoa. I’m here to let you know that when the people coming from the states looking for Samoan who have served in the Korean Way, as my half brother was in Korean Way. His name is [INAUDIBLE], and he’s passed away last 3 years, but he was born and raised here in American Samoa, and then he went to … He joined the Korean War, but I think he did not retire, but he was.

>> When did he serve in Korea?

>> I cannot set the date, but I’ve seen his pictures.

>> What does it mean for you that he served in Korea and you served in the Army too?

>> It means that he has been very pro military, and when I joined the Army, I think he’s done a great decision serving the country not here in American Samoa, but the USA, and I remember when we have a conversation with him. He was telling me when he was in the Korean Way, he showed me his pictures up in the mountain in Korea. I was surprised to know that he was indeed pro military, and he loved the time that he spent in Korean during the Korean Way.

>> So he remembered it with positive, good memory?

>> Yeah. It was a good memory, but the last few years he was in the Maryland, so he passed away was he Virginia, state of Virginia, and so I can tell him …

>> But I’m so glad …

>> … he’s older. He’s older than me.

>> I’m so glad you’re here to honor his memory.

>> Oh, yes. I do respect him and the right decision that he did make serving our people, not only American Samoa, but in the USA, entire USA. As you know, what’s going on in the military and other countries in the war, some people are afraid to join the military because maybe they will get killed when they go in the military, but anywhere you go whether it be a civilian or in the military, you never know when you’re going to go away, when you’re going to pass away, but he did serve the USA and the US military, and I honor him, and I do respect … Not including my brother, but all Samoan people he served, not only Samoan, but all the USA people who he did serve through that particular time.

>> And you too.

>> Okay.

>> And you too.

>> Thank you very much for the opportunity …

>> And thank you for your service.

>> … to hear some of the words of my brother who served Korean War [INAUDIBLE].

>> And thank you.

>> My name is Edmund Hollister. My dad, Edwin Robert Hollister. He was born here in American Samoa, and his birthday is September 18th, 1925. He passed away December 8th, 1976. He was a sergeant. He was in Korea at that time. That’s where [INAUDIBLE].

>> Some might say your father is a hero.

>> I guess.

>> Do you know if he fought combat?

>> He was a medic.

>> A medic?

>> Yes. He always go with people when they go to field, whatever time, they said to go please with those people in infantry.

>> Oh, he was a medic?

>> He was a medic, yes.

>> Wow.

>> That was his job.

>> When did he join the Army?

>> I don’t know, but if you … So my dad received the money from the VA. He was in the military. He went a long time ago back in American Samoa. The VA, the local VA, he [INAUDIBLE] guy. He was doing everything. That’s where he got the money from them. I didn’t know what time. Somewhere around 1954, ’53 … somewhere around ’52 or ’53, somewhere around that time. But he was born in 1925, yes.

>> 1925? So he was a medic during the war. What did he do when he came back?

>> He came back … he was in charge of … He was a teacher in American Samoa. In those days that’s … When he finished teacher, he would be in charge of the women working in the back camp, the Kennedy Company back in those days.

>> What do you … Did he ever mention anything about the war?

>> He didn’t say anything about those things.

>> Why?

>> I don’t know. We were really young at that time. We were really young.

>> What does it mean for you to have a father who was a Korean War veteran? You’re a veteran.

>> You see, I didn’t … In those days, we were young. We didn’t ask those kind of questions. We didn’t even think about joining the military. And finally, when I … I have a bachelor’s. I graduated in 1967, and then I have bought a store. That’s what I had. My dad provided all that stuff, and I take care of those stuff.

>> You came here today to honor him.

>> Yes because I heard on the news yesterday from from Madeon. When I heard that, I thought, “Oh, let me go talk to this lady up there and explain that my dad was in the war at that time.”

>> So it means you’re proud of his service.

>> Oh, yes. When I think about my dad was in it … I’m going to be in the military too. He didn’t retire, but he got out, and finally, when I retired … My daughter, she’s in the Marines right now.

>> Wow, three generations!

>> Yes. My brother, too, had three kids go in the military too. One passed away at war.

>> Why?

>> He passed away when he was in Thailand. That’s where he passed away there. They bring the Hawaiians when Hawaii did the … With his funeral, they sent him to American Samoa. They buried him next to my dad. They have his name up there, Korea, and my brother’s son.

>> Wow. Can you spell your father’s name again?

>> Edwin Robert Hollister.

>> With double L or one L?

>> Two L, yes.

>> Okay. We honor him, okay? Thank you so much. Thank you.

>> But you know, when you get out on commission, then you’re blessed, definitely blessed [INAUDIBLE] DD214, from his paper …

>> Okay. My name is [INAUDIBLE]. I’m a retiree of the Marine Corps, served 20 [INAUDIBLE] years, and we are [INAUDIBLE] specifically by my uncle [INAUDIBLE]. He was a war veteran of the Korean War, and in the ’50s, early, ’50s, he was in Korea, and he got wounded in Korean War. And he served, I don’t know how long, how many times, but after that time, then he joined the [INAUDIBLE] Marines actually in that time after. Then he got discharged around early ’60s or somewhere around there, and he just passed away about 7 or 8 years ago, and most of the time, I heard him, he was talking about some metal stick in his leg, got wounded in Vietnam … I mean, in Korea, and he always talk about he got wounded in the snow, in the time of the snow, cold weather training, or cold weather. He got wounded in Korea in that war, and he’s a super guy to me, great uncle, and he shared his thought and the time of his service, and I’m proud to be his nephew. And that’s all I can remember and I know about him.

>> How old was he when he joined?

>> I believe when he joined, he was probably 19 or 20 years old.

>> Aw. When is his birthday, do you know?

>> Oh, I don’t know. His birthday is around 1937.

>> Why do you think he joined?

>> Well, it was the only way out here in [INAUDIBLE] and a good future for the time. It’s the only way out of [INAUDIBLE] is through the military.

>> And he came back, and he kept on serving in the military?

>> Yes. He came back serving in the military, and he worked as a farmer. They gave him [INAUDIBLE] for the family, and he [INAUDIBLE]. He married a girl in [INAUDIBLE]. That’s where he’s buried right now, in [INAUDIBLE], and a great guy. He was very tough in those days to us. When he came out of the military, he’s a macho man and [INAUDIBLE]. Yeah, he was a tough guy. We were all scared of him.

>> Mm. He had a lot of influence on you.

>> Yes. Oh, yes.

>> Can you spell his name? Can you spell his name?

>> T-A … [INAUDIBLE] T-I-T-A-E, and last name is Fiame, F-I-A-M-E.

>> Well, I hope he knows. I’m sure he knows how proud you were of him, and I’m here to say thank you to him too, so I’m grateful for you for being here to honor his memory, yeah, on behalf of your family. Thank you.

>> I appreciate you coming all the way to California to [INAUDIBLE]. We still have some people that served way before these people in the military, and they talk a lot, these veterans, that’s the only way out [INAUDIBLE] our family, our kids, and after I retire, I came back. I worked for the [INAUDIBLE], so I got out and whatever, and I [INAUDIBLE] for the people of [INAUDIBLE].

>> Mm. Thank you for your service, too.

>> Thank you.

>> All right. My name is [INAUDIBLE]. This is my sister, Hannah. She’s the youngest of our siblings.

>> The youngest of 11.

>> My niece, Sa, named after my grandmother and my niece, which is her daughter, named Elena. We are from … We are all relatives of our uncle that was killed in the Korean War, and his name is [INAUDIBLE] …

>> [INAUDIBLE].

>> [INAUDIBLE]. He’s from … He has many villages from [INAUDIBLE] and [INAUDIBLE]. Yeah.

>> [INAUDIBLE].

>> So we weren’t there when he was alive because he died in 1950 in the Korean War, and I was born in 1956. My daughter … My sister is 1965.

>> 1965.

>> So we didn’t see him, but we know from our dad’s stories about his brother. My dad is … He’s the one … The uncle, my uncle died in Korea, and he’s older than my dad. My dad is the youngest of the siblings, so based on his story, he joined the military and the armed forces, and then he went off island because of that, and he … When he left, he didn’t marry, but he has a girlfriend that he was suppose to marry before he left, but that didn’t happen, and based on our dad’s story, word arrived from off island that he was killed. He was killed, and they waited for 7 to 9 months, I think 7 months, before his body was found and …

>> [INAUDIBLE].

>> … transferred down here to the islands, so he was brought in with the word that they’re not supposed to open up the coffin, so they haven’t seen if he was really in there, and he was buried in Pago Pago, his mother’s land in Pago Pago, so that’s all we know about him, but when he died late in 1950, my mother gave birth to one of my brothers and because of uncle was passed away, he was named after my uncle. Yeah. That’s how we remember him because we did not see him in-person. He passed away before we were born.

>> Do you know which battle he passed …

>> The Korean War.

>> I know, which battle?

>> During the war, which battle? Like, where did he die?

>> I don’t know.

>> I don’t remember.

>> We don’t remember, and I …

>> What … Do you know what date …

>> Date?

>> … he died, what date?

>> Yes, it’s in the sheet of … and on the tombstone. It’s August 23, 1950.

>> August 23rd, 1950.

>> Yes.

>> Oh, that’s during the beginning of the war. That was the most difficult time of the war.

>> And we were told … My dad told us that he’s … where he was doing on the … Through he war was he the operator of a tank, the machine, and he was killed right there.

>> Oh.

>> He was operating the tank.

>> Oh.

>> The big gun, yeah.

>> How old was he?

>> I think he was … Because he was born in July 12th, 1933.

>> He was baby. He was 18.

>> Yeah.

>> Eighteen.

>> He just turned 18, so he joined the army right when he turned 18?

>> Yeah. Who?

>> Your uncle.

>> I think so.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah.

>> When did he join the army?

>> I’m not sure.

>> Yeah.

>> We don’t have that.

>> Seventeen, 18.

>> Yes.

>> Yeah. He was a baby, so what does it mean for you to honor him here today?

>> Very much important to us because ever since he passed away in the war doing what … I think it was discussed during my dad’s time, but during our time, we never speak of him because we know very little about him. Yeah. We haven’t seen him. If only we can find a picture of him, but we don’t have it.

>> No picture?

>> No.

>> No picture.

>> I think those times …

>> Not even his baby picture?

>> I think those times, there were no camera on the island.

>> Oh.

>> Yeah, so …

>> But I knew he was planned to get married when he comes back.

>> Yeah, but that didn’t happening.

>> Oh, but no picture, so nobody knows how he looks like.

>> Maybe my dad is the one who only knows how he looks like because …

>> They made a song. They made a song about him.

>> Yeah. There’s a song about him.

>> Really?

>> [INAUDIBLE].

>> It’s on the Internet.

>> Yeah.

>> Do you sing it?

>> I forgot the words to that song.

>> I used to sing it with my grandmother, and that’s long ago.

[Lyrics]

[INAUDIBLE]

>> Come on. Sing it. Sing it. Sing it.

>> I forgot it.

>> Yes. It’s … I forgot because …

>> Sing it. Sing it. Try. Try.

>> … it’s been 40 years.

>> Okay.

[Lyrics]

[INAUDIBLE]

>> It’s going to make me make tears.

>> What does it mean?

>> But that’s how the song goes.

>> What does the song mean?

[Lyrics]

[INAUDIBLE]

>> [INAUDIBLE]. Oh.

>> Oh.

>> Asking about where he is.

>> Oh.

>> It’s …

[Lyrics]

[INAUDIBLE]

>> Who made the song?

[Lyrics]

[INAUDIBLE]

>> That’s the name of the song. That’s how we would remember him.

>> Sorry, very emotional.

>> Well, I’m here to honor him and his memory.

>> I mean, it’s a happy feeling to … for today to remember him again.

>> Yes.

>> But it totally forgot the whole song, the whole lyrics, but that’s how …

>> I used to sing it.

>> But that’s how I could remember.

>> I used to sing the song with my grandma, but it’s 40 years ago now, 40 years.

>> But it’s amazing that you’re … All of you are here to honor him. I mean, I don’t know know him, but I know where he is. He’s with the Lord.

>> Yeah.

>> And he’s watching over all of your family. Yes, and I think …

>> And he’s at peace.

>> … he appreciates it very much that you remember him.

>> Yeah.

>> Thank you. Thank you.

>> Thank you. If only we could see a picture of him, it’s …

>> Maybe [INAUDIBLE] because our dad and his brother [INAUDIBLE]. They only have one sister. Maybe she has some photos, but she pass away too.

>> Oh. I think that’s why it’s so important that we remember and we record the history.

>> I don’t know if she were … Of his record when he join the offices if there’s any picture.

>> There has to be.

>> I know.

>> Oh, I hope we can find it.

>> Let’s try to find it.

>> [INAUDIBLE].

>> Yes, let’s try to find it.

>> Pictures of him, we didn’t even see his face.

>> Okay. Okay. Thank you so much. Okay, everybody say …

>> Thank you so much for your time.

>> … bye.

>> Thank you.

>> My name is Suaka Shuster. I was born in the village of Pago Pago and born in the hospital, the naval hospital, that we had in Mauna Loa. That’s where I was born. I … What happened is you wanted to me to say?

>> American Samoa, you said, what everybody need to know about American Samoa.

>> Well, American Samoa is very unique because they don’t have to join the service because of the population that we have, we don’t have to go out and actually volunteer to go, be told that at that time. So I got registered, or when I went to the United States, I registered to vote. Everybody goes over there that’s 18 years old has to register, so I didn’t know what it’s for until I got a letter from them that they drafted me in the army, so I went in to see them and see what all this about. They said why you drafted in the military. I said, “Oh, yeah, [INAUDIBLE],” and then I said, “Well, can I choose where I go?” He said, “Yes, I can choose,” so I choose to go in the Air Force in 1952, so I served the Air Force for 4 years.

>> Why did you choose to go to the Air Force because Air Force was new at the time?

>> It’s new, and as a I kid, I was always excited and wanted to be a pilot, but unfortunately, we didn’t have that. You see here in Samoa at the time, you learn how to become a pilot, so that was [INAUDIBLE]. I want to serve the Air Force because I was interested in flying, so they send me to school to Texas in Amarillo for [INAUDIBLE] almost 4 years to become a member of a flight crew of an airplane, and it happened to be a B-47 bomber that carries an atomic bomb. They told me [INAUDIBLE] know if I like this because I don’t want [INAUDIBLE], but I found out it was just a safety precaution because of the enemy, and we do have to do it. We have to do it. A lot of talking [INAUDIBLE], so I joined for 4 years in regular military service as a flight engineer for a B-47 bomber. The crew members, there were three of … four of us: the pilot, the copilot, the navigator and the flight engineer. That’s all the people you can fit in the airplane, and the seat I was on, I was sitting in the air with an atomic bomb, right in the back of me, and I hope every day that the alert to fly that we don’t have to use this thing because I know that’s wrong, killing people, and fortunate enough, we never had to drop the atomic bomb. The time before when it happened, the same outfit that I was in [INAUDIBLE] a bombing when we took it to Japan, two places where they dropped the bomb, and they killed a lot of people, and I don’t want to be … have that experience all my life. That’s all I want to share with you.

>> What do you remember about … How many flights did you take, and what do you remember about Korea?

>> For … I never landed in Korea, never landed. I was always in the air. I’d fly from California through Okinawa, and then we were in the air all the time.

>> So you were in Japan, stationed in Japan?

>> Yeah, in Okinawa.

>> On Okinawa?

>> And then we were stationed in … We flew to different places all the time, so England or a station, permanent stations, Riverside, California, and they’d evacuate us and send us to different places, and when there’s nothing else to do, then we’d round the United States, body of the United States. Those were our jobs that we …

>> Have you have been back to Korea?

>> No.

>> What do you know about it, and what does it make you feel as a Korean War veteran?

>> I feel that I’ve done the job, that it’s for the safety of the people, not to go and kill the people within there, but just to put them in safety. That’s my feeling.

>> So you started out by saying that American Samoans didn’t need to …

>> Didn’t need to.

>> … volunteer, but you went, and many people went. What does it make you feel as a Samoan.

>> I feel proud to have done someone is going out to sacrifice his life for other people.

>> Yeah. You should be very proud.

>> It’s a small place, and there’s a few of us, and we’re eager to join the Army and the Air Force and the Navy and sacrifice, to help others [INAUDIBLE].

>> I think you may be one of the few remaining Korean War veterans on this island.

>> Yes, I am one of the [INAUDIBLE].

>> Yes, yes.

>> I’m still here.

>> Yes, we’re here to honor you today.

>> Yes.

>> Yes, later the Lieutenant Governor and …

>> Hello, everybody. I am here. I’m so excited. I’m honored to be here with my American-Samoan-Korean-War veteran grandpa. His name is …

>> Yaputo.

>> … Yaputo …

>> Avengario.

>> … Avengario. I’m also here with the Veterans of Foreign War commander, state commander, Inapo Maria. Aw, oh. I just told him that I’m very grateful to be here, and I gave him this pin, and I paid my utmost respect with a Korean bow, and he said, “I was just doing his” … He was just doing his job, but as you can see, he has so … He has a Purple Heart.

>> I think I have two Purple Hearts.

>> Two Purple Hearts …

>> And a Bronze Star.

>> … and a Bronze Star.

>> I’ve got three Bronze Stars with valor.

>> Three Bronze Stars with valor.

>> With valor.

>> How do you have three Bronze Stars?

>> They need to …

>> I got a combat patch.

>> … recognize his service, especially on, what you think, on Veteran’s Day …

>> Oh, my goodness.

>> … because I never knew he has this.

>> Wow.

>> I’m glad that you came.

>> Aw.

>> And I’m glad. My heart, I’m glad that you came because I’m so proud for his service.

>> I’m so thankful. Can you tell us about your war experience?

>> The only really [INAUDIBLE]. When we do our job and all good ones, I am still living and really fortunate [INAUDIBLE].

>> Well, you did your job very, very, very well because you defended the freedom for not only Korea but for this world really because the Korean War helped end Communism, but you should be very proud because not a lot of people know about American Samoa and American Samoans, and so the Korean War, people forget, but people don’t know American Samoa. So you almost died, and that’s why you have a Purple Heart, two Purple Hearts and three Bronze Medals. You must have seen many people die too. I hope that you remember the war but not only of pain but also of goodness. What year did you go to Korea?

>> ’52.

>> 1952? For how long?

>> [INAUDIBLE] and when I returned back after about June ’54, we finished off [INAUDIBLE].

>> So you were there from 1952 to ’54?

>> Yeah. I started on [INAUDIBLE].

>> Hmm.

>> [INAUDIBLE]

>> Oh.

>> It’s for us to remember.

>> Oh, thank you.

>> I’ll give that to him.

>> Okay. Thank you. She’s giving this to me, and she’s giving one for you, but I don’t feel like I deserve this.

>> What?

>> This medal.

>> No, no, yes, you do. No, you do. That’s my commander’s pin.

>> Okay. Thank you.

>> And you more than deserve it. You came all the way down here to say thank you to Korean veterans. Nobody can do it. Nobody do it from other … other country, but I know it’s precious to him, and he feels great that people like you that remember their service during the … This is my commander’s pin for you too, Papa.

[ Chatter ]

>> My big Papa. You’re my big Papa.

>> So no matter at least I know where he lives, so we can pay tax. Okay?

>> So do you remember … What do you remember about Korea?

>> I was in Korea … [INAUDIBLE] really, it was too cold. I went in the wintertime. Oh, boy, I don’t know which one I was scared to: the war or the cold.

>> Or the cold.

[ Chatter ]

>> Or the island.

>> Yeah, you stay over here. It’s warm.

>> Oh, it was cold.

>> Oh.

>> Now when I returned, I was wanted back in [INAUDIBLE] to get some [INAUDIBLE], and they gave me the two choice to go to finish up my time in Vietnam. One is to work [INAUDIBLE], they said, “You can go to Korea, or you can go back to Vietnam.” I was thinking about how cold, so I ran a call to a job in Vietnam [INAUDIBLE] about living over there [INAUDIBLE].

>> Hmm.

>> When I told him I’m involved back in Vietnam.

>> Yes, you served in Korea and Vietnam.

>> Yeah.

>> A lot of them, they served Korea and then Vietnam because they’re kind of back to back.

>> But so you received both Purple Hearts in Korea or Vietnam?

>> Vietnam.

>> Both in Vietnam?

>> Yeah, and [INAUDIBLE].

>> Oh, all three Bronze Stars in Vietnam?

>> Yeah.

>> Not in Korea?

>> Korea, I could [INAUDIBLE].

>> Oh.

[ Chatter ]

>> Combat.

>> Combat.

>> That’s one for the … That’s for the star.

>> Do you think your experience in the war and Korea helped you become more brave in Vietnam because you knew more about war?

>> I think right now it’s equipment. They get all brand-new ones that really … That was a big change. Now everything is [INAUDIBLE]

>> Mm. What division did you belong to in the Korean War?

>> I was in Third Division, Seventh Regiment, First Battalion.

>> Okay, Seventh …

>> Seventh Regiment.

>> … Regiment.

>> Third …

>> Third …

>> Third …

>> Third division.

>> Yes.

>> Okay.

>> Seventh Regiment and …

>> Third Division, Seventh Regiment.

>> Yes.

>> … and First Battalion.

>> First Battalion, okay.

>> Third Division.

>> Yes.

>> Seventh Regiment and First Battalion.

>> Yes.

>> Division, regiment then battalion.

>> Yes.

>> And what company?

>> Oh, yeah.

>> I was in the First Battalion and Company D.

>> D Company, Delta Company.

>> Did you experience any discrimination?

>> I experienced …

>> Discrimination.

>> Oh, there was some struggle because the part of the Third Division, the other regiment comes from Puerto Rico.

>> Oh.

>> So …

>> Puerto Rican, Hispanic.

>> Puerto Rican.

>> No one understands each other.

>> Oh.

>> And they think that’s the reason why they started changing [INAUDIBLE]. The regiment on Puerto Rico, it’s changing around.

>> Oh, okay.

>> Same thing over in [INAUDIBLE].

>> That’s good to know.

>> Yeah [INAUDIBLE].

>> Are we going on 20?

>> Mm-hmm. Thank you so much for meeting me. I’m so happy. I’m so happy. When you look at this heart, don’t forget me, okay?

>> Yeah.

>> Okay?

>> Yeah, I know.

>> I know.

>> I know because I don’t know how many people are alive and [INAUDIBLE] I hope they have somebody because all the people I went to Korea, I never [INAUDIBLE].

>> Oh.

You know a guy named Malleva, Maneva Pioli?

>> [INAUDIBLE]

>> No, no, but were you serving in Korea with him? He’s here. He arrived. We’re going to interview him.

>> Yes.

>> And so we thought that you’d make it to the center so you can see if you’re going to meet some of your …

>> Is that Malleva de Chun?

>> Malleva, no, no, not Union Malleva. Union Malleva is here too. He’s alive.

>> Yeah.

>> But Diauli Maneva .

>> Oh, no, I don’t know him.

>> Papa, how old are you?

>> Huh?

>> How old are you?

>> Eighty-eight.

>> Eighty-eight, so you went to Korea when you were 20, huh? No, 22, 1952, you were 22. Okay. Well, so this is my Papa, big Papa and American-Samoan Papa, and I’m just so happy to be here. It took a long time for me to be here, to get here. It was very difficult, but it’s so worth it, seeing your tears. It was worth all of my tears to get here, so, everyone, look. Can you stand up? Look. Look at this. Okay? Look at this. We’re going to …

>> Is that you and your wife over there?

>> Yes.

>> Get the photo of the … Oh …

[ Chatter ]

>> Yeah that’s [INAUDIBLE].

>> Yes, and I want to show he served in the Vietnam. He’s a warrior citizen, and his Purple Heart, Bronze Star, look at all his medals, not that I’m saying a veteran is one who has more medals, his life is any more precious. I’m not saying that. However, he went above and beyond to really serve the country, and the thing is, he never forgot. He never forgot.

>> I still get a Korean [INAUDIBLE]. That one right in the middle in the third row.

>> Oh, this one?

>> Way down, way down.

>> Way down.

>> Right there.

>> Yes, yes, yes.

>> That’s a unit citation, your unit citation.

>> Yes, so look at this. So I just want everybody to know that the veterans never forget their service, yes. Look at this. I want … Can you show this one here down here? I think he was in the Second Infantry. This is an Indianhead. Were you in the Second Division too?

>> Yeah, my son was stationed.

>> Okay.

>> He gave me that poster when he …

>> Oh, okay, so your second … So your son was in the Second Infantry Division in Korea.

>> Yeah, [INAUDIBLE].

>> Oh, wow, yes, so his son is also a Korean defense veteran, so he’s an Indianhead. So is my boss and many people out there, so again, I just thank you, Grandpa Pito, for receiving me today and everyone. I’m going to now meet other veterans at the Veterans Center, and we’re going to have a ceremony.

>> You’ve got time.

>> I’m just so happy to be here, so thank you, yes.

[ Chatter ]

>> Thank you. Bye.